I have a big problem with this

[debtdbruno]

great points Ken.......your right, EPE are ****ed if they do or don't....

When all you have is The name, likeness and Image, there's a limit to what you can work with

[KPM]

Good point. Let me add that even though Lisa owns the estate including the archives and planes, she cannot shut down Graceland as it's a business that would affect the local economy. She would get sued if she tried to and most likely lose. Therefor the owners which would be CKX and Apollo would be the ones to suffer financially. Apollo could afford it but CKX could not.

You are exactly correct-Lisa could not just close down Graceland but being a business in a local economy has nothing whatsoever to do with that decision-any business can close its doors, relocate, shutdown for a time, etc any time they want or need to.
But as you point out-she has a deal with CKX/Apollo and they have the 85% share-of course she could perhaps take them to court if she really wanted to close.....she could argue that since taking the 85% share-they have not lived up to the expectations that she and her lawyers were given when they were negotiating the deal-but I would give her a 30% chance of winning such a suit.
Philosophically speaking-If I were her and could do so without having a court battle -I would close it down.
Many seem so unhappy, many want to run the estate as if it were their own and to make decisions which no matter how simple they sound on paper or in a forum are much much more complicated than imagined......and if she was able to close it down-then she would really be the villain to the same who are unhappy....I could hear the comments now.

[KPM]

To some degree you could say that if they don't rebuild things around Graceland the attraction could lose a lot of tourism. So that would be protecting Lisa's future even though she probably has enough money to last her and her kid’s future. They can do whatever they want to do with their money but there could become a time that they lose people coming to Graceland over conditions, and then it might be to late.

I would say that yes she is now totally secure.
You know there is no disagreement about upkeeping your property for the future, the problem ends up being how "BIG" does it have to be.
They have continually upgraded the tours and the grounds-obviously not to the extent some want....but we only know one side of the equation the side we gleem from info that is "released to the public" for every business there are issues and topics that are known to the real insiders at the top of the heap.
What those issues and topics have been for Lisa and EPE since Lisa took over her inheritance I have no clue-but I'm sure they are there like all businesses. That is why any criticism is just "second guessing" those who have all the information-not just the public side.
Its not like Graceland is falling down in a heap, or new exhibits are not being brought out each season....they have spent money acquiring what they can acquire....such as the TV specials, they did a good job of packaging and promoting those, they have not just totally stagnated for the last 35 years. Sillerman was the next step-perhaps to placate people who are constantly harping about "what should be done" and that was a mistake IMO
Apollo so far-the jury is out.
As far as the community around Graceland-they should do their part-but Memphis has drug its feet for 35 years......IMO the citizens and government were wanting Graceland to do "more than their fair share" as a member of the community......never mind that already Memphis was reaping huge returns on tourism dollars that were brought into the Public coffers by Graceland and Elvis's image.
The taxes would have to go up big time in Memphis if Graceland was not open and doing its part.
Criticism is easy-understanding is a lot harder.

[J.P]

there already is graceland

[King Of The Whole World]

I would say that yes she is now totally secure.
You know there is no disagreement about upkeeping your property for the future, the problem ends up being how "BIG" does it have to be.
They have continually upgraded the tours and the grounds-obviously not to the extent some want....but we only know one side of the equation the side we gleem from info that is "released to the public" for every business there are issues and topics that are known to the real insiders at the top of the heap.
What those issues and topics have been for Lisa and EPE since Lisa took over her inheritance I have no clue-but I'm sure they are there like all businesses. That is why any criticism is just "second guessing" those who have all the information-not just the public side.
Its not like Graceland is falling down in a heap, or new exhibits are not being brought out each season....they have spent money acquiring what they can acquire....such as the TV specials, they did a good job of packaging and promoting those, they have not just totally stagnated for the last 35 years. Sillerman was the next step-perhaps to placate people who are constantly harping about "what should be done" and that was a mistake IMO
Apollo so far-the jury is out.
As far as the community around Graceland-they should do their part-but Memphis has drug its feet for 35 years......IMO the citizens and government were wanting Graceland to do "more than their fair share" as a member of the community......never mind that already Memphis was reaping huge returns on tourism dollars that were brought into the Public coffers by Graceland and Elvis's image.
The taxes would have to go up big time in Memphis if Graceland was not open and doing its part.
Criticism is easy-understanding is a lot harder.

I agree. I would just like to see something that is a little bigger for people to rest in a climate controlled environment. I will be at Graceland during Elvis week and was there 2 years ago when it was 118 degrees. People hang out in the stores and the few places that they have air-conditioning, maybe that’s why they do that so you will hang out in the stores and buy even more stuff. I live in the south and am use to the hot weather but it becomes unbelievable in Memphis. I don't think an improvement like that would be asking too much. I know they have made improvements over the last 30 years.

I guess one thing I have always been surprised about is the lawn at Graceland is never better looking. I have always expected it to be like a golf course, green and lush. But there is a lot of bare spots and brown. I guess I’m crazy but Graceland would look unbelievable if the grass was in pristine shape.

[Diane]

Here is my lowly opinion....I would have no desire at all to visit an ultra modern museum for Elvis. Graceland being open to the fans is more than I ever expected and I feel for what it is, it's the best deal. He lived there and loved there and his spirit is all over the place and as Ken pointed out, it's what made Lisa's life secure as he wanted it to be.

If Lisa ever decides to close Graceland, that is if she could win that kind of a suit, I'd feel it was her personal right and I wouldn't feel a loss. I don't need ANYTHING to keep him in my mind and heart.

[King Of The Whole World]

Here is my lowly opinion....I would have no desire at all to visit an ultra modern museum for Elvis. Graceland being open to the fans is more than I ever expected and I feel for what it is, it's the best deal. He lived there and loved there and his spirit is all over the place and as Ken pointed out, it's what made Lisa's life secure as he wanted it to be.

If Lisa ever decides to close Graceland, that is if she could win that kind of a suit, I'd feel it was her personal right and I wouldn't feel a loss. I don't need ANYTHING to keep him in my mind and heart.

Great point and I agree. I would feel a slight loss however, I love going to Graceland it’s the closest I will get to my idol. You can feel his sprit and presence all over the place.

[vivaelvis]

I agree. I would just like to see something that is a little bigger for people to rest in a climate controlled environment. I will be at Graceland during Elvis week and was there 2 years ago when it was 118 degrees. People hang out in the stores and the few places that they have air-conditioning, maybe that’s why they do that so you will hang out in the stores and buy even more stuff. I live in the south and am use to the hot weather but it becomes unbelievable in Memphis. I don't think an improvement like that would be asking too much. I know they have made improvements over the last 30 years.

I guess one thing I have always been surprised about is the lawn at Graceland is never better looking. I have always expected it to be like a golf course, green and lush. But there is a lot of bare spots and brown. I guess I’m crazy but Graceland would look unbelievable if the grass was in pristine shape.

You couldn't be more correct with the highlighted statement. However, I think EPE sees it like this. If nobody is complaining enough then why fix it? I personally have contacted EPE in the past to complain about this and I was told (lied to) that it was being addressed. But that was back in the 90's and nothing at all has changed in that department. THIS is my biggest problem. Not a hi-tech modernized museum, although one is much needed to introduce newer generations to his legacy and his past time, not just through the music.

Here's how I see it. If EPE/Apollo/CKX continue to treat guest the way they do with making them stay outdoors or jack up the prices of their attractions, then they better expect to see the attendances drop even further. This year they know they're getting back the visitors because of the big 35th anniversary. But we'll see if it continues in the next 5 years if nothing has been done, concerning a new hotel for guests and a new INDOOR center for visitors to at least enjoy their time and money.

[King Of The Whole World]

You couldn't be more correct with the highlighted statement. However, I think EPE sees it like this. If nobody is complaining enough then why fix it? I personally have contacted EPE in the past to complain about this and I was told (lied to) that it was being addressed. But that was back in the 90's and nothing at all has changed in that department. THIS is my biggest problem. Not a hi-tech modernized museum, although one is much needed to introduce newer generations to his legacy and his past time, not just through the music.

Here's how I see it. If EPE/Apollo/CKX continue to treat guest the way they do with making them stay outdoors or jack up the prices of their attractions, then they better expect to see the attendances drop even further. This year they know they're getting back the visitors because of the big 35th anniversary. But we'll see if it continues in the next 5 years if nothing has been done, concerning a new hotel for guests and a new INDOOR center for visitors to at least enjoy their time and money.

Are you kidding, they added 2 fans with water misters on them.

[lvelvis]

i never knew the beatles had rtheir own museum , and what a nice one it is . Many thanks for bringing this to our attention . ELVIS PRESLEY needs to look better and atrack fans and people , and they are not going to do it with old dilapatated strip malls , and hotels. It's about time E,P,E, take responsability and overide and stop waiting for the city to help , they are so cheap and it is not only showing , it is hurting ELVIS PRESLEY and his memory. If anything ELVIS PRESLEY deserves the best, after ll he was/is/always will be THE BEST EVER.

[vivaelvis]

i never knew the beatles had rtheir own museum , and what a nice one it is . Many thanks for bringing this to our attention . ELVIS PRESLEY needs to look better and atrack fans and people , and they are not going to do it with old dilapatated strip malls , and hotels. It's about time E,P,E, take responsability and overide and stop waiting for the city to help , they are so cheap and it is not only showing , it is hurting ELVIS PRESLEY and his memory. If anything ELVIS PRESLEY deserves the best, after ll he was/is/always will be THE BEST EVER.

Best post of the year! And to the point and totally accurate!

Elvis is the King of Rock and freaking roll and he gets treated by his own estate and company as if he was just another person. While the entire city of Liverpool glorifies and praises the Beatles. Memphis can't even acknowledge Elvis' importance in his own home town. If it weren't for the people spending money, Tupelo wouldn't care either. Disgusting!

[Jungleroom76]

Having been a moderator on TCB-World for over 7 years, I have seen MANY debates come and go...including several on this topic. But I have to say that I am SO excited to see such a spirited conversation going on over this topic!! Even though it's been discussed before, there are new ideas, new links to new resources to back up information being presented, and it is all very exciting!!

Kudos to all of you for this intriguing and enlightening conversation!! Please keep it going -- THIS is what TCB-World is all about!!!

TCB!
Mike

[Tommy]

Having been a moderator on TCB-World for over 7 years, I have seen MANY debates come and go...including several on this topic. But I have to say that I am SO excited to see such a spirited conversation going on over this topic!! Even though it's been discussed before, there are new ideas, new links to new resources to back up information being presented, and it is all very exciting!!

Kudos to all of you for this intriguing and enlightening conversation!! Please keep it going -- THIS is what TCB-World is all about!!!

TCB!
Mike

I agree.................................................

[JRtherealJR]

I have ofter wondered what it is that makes the Graceland renovation issue so important to you........its your number one issue.
The number one issue for me concerning Elvis is his talent and charisma-his accomplishments as an artist-those are things that do not depend on renovations-because they will exist as long as his voice and performances are available.
http://www.enotes.com/elvis-presley-...nterprises-inc

The reason why Graceland is so important to some fans (myself included) is not just because it is the second most visited home in America, not just because it is an icon itself, but because it makes Elvis unique amongst other stars in that it gives Elvis' stardom a visible place in the real world. It's the centre of everything Elvis and it's a place where Elvis is associated with by people the world over.

The death week pilgrimage where the world's media watches thousands of fans congregate at Graceland reminds non-fans of Elvis' huge impact and popularity. I agree that since Graceland opened, a lot more could have been done. Yes they have bought up a couple of strip malls, remodelled the racquetball building and built the car museum. But none of this is particuarly extraordinary. The Heartbreak Hotel & the Memphis restaurant both failed and the Sillerman deal was a lost opportunity. EPE needs some fresh ideas and some new blood into the company if it is to increase tourism to Graceland or at least maintain current levels- of course they had this with Sillerman but we all know how that ended.

Also don't forget Graceland attracts thousands of casual visitors every year and some of these surely will go on to be fans. Graceland gives a lot of visibility to Elvis and his fandom- remember when the Japanese Prime Minister and President Bush visited a few years ago? This is the type of publicity that stars today can only dream of!

What could EPE do? Look at the O2 in London, for years the former Millenium dome was seen as just a "big tent" and was a national joke. But now it is one of the premier concert venues in the world attracting the biggest stars. Maybe part of the problem lies with the fact that Graceland is in Memphis- not exactly a prestigious tourist destination like Florida or Hollywood?

[vivaelvis]

The reason why Graceland is so important to some fans (myself included) is not just because it is the second most visited home in America, not just because it is an icon itself, but because it makes Elvis unique amongst other stars in that it gives Elvis' stardom a visible place in the real world. It's the centre of everything Elvis and it's a place where Elvis is associated with by people the world over.

The death week pilgrimage where the world's media watches thousands of fans congregate at Graceland reminds non-fans of Elvis' huge impact and popularity. I agree that since Graceland opened, a lot more could have been done. Yes they have bought up a couple of strip malls, remodelled the racquetball building and built the car museum. But none of this is particuarly extraordinary. The Heartbreak Hotel & the Memphis restaurant both failed and the Sillerman deal was a lost opportunity. EPE needs some fresh ideas and some new blood into the company if it is to increase tourism to Graceland or at least maintain current levels- of course they had this with Sillerman but we all know how that ended.

Also don't forget Graceland attracts thousands of casual visitors every year and some of these surely will go on to be fans. Graceland gives a lot of visibility to Elvis and his fandom- remember when the Japanese Prime Minister and President Bush visited a few years ago? This is the type of publicity that stars today can only dream of!

What could EPE do? Look at the O2 in London, for years the former Millenium dome was seen as just a "big tent" and was a national joke. But now it is one of the premier concert venues in the world attracting the biggest stars. Maybe part of the problem lies with the fact that Graceland is in Memphis- not exactly a prestigious tourist destination like Florida or Hollywood?

Outstanding post! I couldn't agree more!

[debtdbruno]

i never knew the beatles had rtheir own museum , and what a nice one it is . Many thanks for bringing this to our attention . ELVIS PRESLEY needs to look better and atrack fans and people , and they are not going to do it with old dilapatated strip malls , and hotels. It's about time E,P,E, take responsability and overide and stop waiting for the city to help , they are so cheap and it is not only showing , it is hurting ELVIS PRESLEY and his memory. If anything ELVIS PRESLEY deserves the best, after ll he was/is/always will be THE BEST EVER.

Its called 'Elvis and us'

Not all about the Beatles, there's Elvis memorabilia there too. I'm going in August

[KPM]

The reason why Graceland is so important to some fans (myself included) is not just because it is the second most visited home in America, not just because it is an icon itself, but because it makes Elvis unique amongst other stars in that it gives Elvis' stardom a visible place in the real world. It's the centre of everything Elvis and it's a place where Elvis is associated with by people the world over.

The death week pilgrimage where the world's media watches thousands of fans congregate at Graceland reminds non-fans of Elvis' huge impact and popularity. I agree that since Graceland opened, a lot more could have been done. Yes they have bought up a couple of strip malls, remodelled the racquetball building and built the car museum. But none of this is particuarly extraordinary. The Heartbreak Hotel & the Memphis restaurant both failed and the Sillerman deal was a lost opportunity. EPE needs some fresh ideas and some new blood into the company if it is to increase tourism to Graceland or at least maintain current levels- of course they had this with Sillerman but we all know how that ended.

Also don't forget Graceland attracts thousands of casual visitors every year and some of these surely will go on to be fans. Graceland gives a lot of visibility to Elvis and his fandom- remember when the Japanese Prime Minister and President Bush visited a few years ago? This is the type of publicity that stars today can only dream of!

What could EPE do? Look at the O2 in London, for years the former Millenium dome was seen as just a "big tent" and was a national joke. But now it is one of the premier concert venues in the world attracting the biggest stars. Maybe part of the problem lies with the fact that Graceland is in Memphis- not exactly a prestigious tourist destination like Florida or Hollywood?

As you point out "Graceland" is important to fans it was the focal point of Elvis's life till he died there......it is in essence a museum because it was his home-the Beatles facility is a museum because someone decided it was needed as a focal point for Beatle fans and tourists who come to Liverpool since there is no single "home" or site that really could be correlated to "Gracelands importance" to we fans of Elvis. 4 individuals comprised the Beatles and they did not all live together for most of their life.
So now this state of the art museum in Liverpool is the place for Beatle fans to see all things Beatles.
The Sillerman deal was a lost opportunity-but not due to EPE or Lisa, they brought in Sillerman after his pitch for what he could do to take that next step-he has the 85% sayso for any change of consequence-and we know what has happened.

[KPM]

Are you kidding, they added 2 fans with water misters on them.

I live near St Louis-and the weather patterns they get-we get.
Drought like situations come along every year-today it is 97 degrees at this moment in St Louis similar to Memphis. It is very hard to keep pristeen grass in climates that are so crazy that you can have 97 degrees one day, and then 65 degrees a few days later-the midwest at the Mississippi river is a collision point for west coast weather movement and southerm moisture which makes it hard to keep grounds in good shape.
A local retirement home that I was associated with for a few years had 127 acres of grounds with 30 acres developed with a state of the art sprinkler system (not cheap)-but in the first year we found out that althought it helped we still had grass that died or browned out -especially after a severe winter with a lot of snow and low temps. We had a company come in and they said we used too much ice melt on the streets and walkways to melt snow-it was seeping deep into soil and then affecting grass growth in spring and summer.....their answer was to use less ice melt.
That was impossible with 50 driveways, 10 private streets, several parking lots -and most importantly elderly people who had to move from home to car, home to dining rooms at the main complex, car to walks etc......the board said "We do not want people hurt and lawsuits" that ended the worry about brown spots from time to time.
All I am trying to show is with every "simple problem" their is not always a satisfactory answer-that satisfies all you want to do.

[KPM]

i never knew the beatles had rtheir own museum , and what a nice one it is . Many thanks for bringing this to our attention . ELVIS PRESLEY needs to look better and atrack fans and people , and they are not going to do it with old dilapatated strip malls , and hotels. It's about time E,P,E, take responsability and overide and stop waiting for the city to help , they are so cheap and it is not only showing , it is hurting ELVIS PRESLEY and his memory. If anything ELVIS PRESLEY deserves the best, after ll he was/is/always will be THE BEST EVER.

Contact Apollo if you think it hurts Elvis's memory they have the 85% ownership rights to the image and likeness and the lease with Lisa for the mansions use. EPE is waiting also for some indication of what the next concrete step will be-waiting since 2005.
They waited on Memphis for 35 years-EPE (and even Apollo)are not in the business of urban redevelopement.
They have a stake in urban redevelopement-like every business owner in Memphis-and no business brings in as
much to the city from all points as Graceland (such gratitude)
It amazes me-before Disneyland was built Walt Disney got all kinds of things done for the property that ended up being used to build the park-literally all government agencies that had a jurisdiction for individual problems worked their rears off to help get this major money maker built.
Taxbreaks, credits, red tape cut, help that amounted to millions in helping Disney get this project done.
I do not see that same record of help from Memphis over the last 35 years-but EPE is the bad guy....sorry I just do not see them as the black dressed villains tying people to the tracks and stealing their money. Its unfair, its not drawing a picture that is accurate and balanced.
I will say it again-they could do everything some declare is a must-and it still would not be enough.

[vivaelvis]

Contact Apollo if you think it hurts Elvis's memory they have the 85% ownership rights to the image and likeness and the lease with Lisa for the mansions use. EPE is waiting also for some indication of what the next concrete step will be-waiting since 2005.
They waited on Memphis for 35 years-EPE (and even Apollo)are not in the business of urban redevelopement.
They have a stake in urban redevelopement-like every business owner in Memphis-and no business brings in as
much to the city from all points as Graceland (such gratitude)
It amazes me-before Disneyland was built Walt Disney got all kinds of things done for the property that ended up being used to build the park-literally all government agencies that had a jurisdiction for individual problems worked their rears off to help get this major money maker built.
Taxbreaks, credits, red tape cut, help that amounted to millions in helping Disney get this project done.
I do not see that same record of help from Memphis over the last 35 years-but EPE is the bad guy....sorry I just do not see them as the black dressed villains tying people to the tracks and stealing their money. Its unfair, its not drawing a picture that is accurate and balanced.
I will say it again-they could do everything some declare is a must-and it still would not be enough.

As big as Graceland is for Memphis, it's not the top money making business. FedEx is.

The redevelopment part is about to happen as of this November as ground breaking is set to begin on what will be a 3-phase 3-year project, starting at E. Brooks down three miles to Shelby Drive. The city is doing its part, albeit 30 years too late, but at least they're finally getting it done. It's now time for EPE to live up to their end of the bargain and deliver by making drastic needed upgrades, starting with a new hotel and a new visitor's center. Their main excuse was that the city had to get involved before they could invest $250 million into the area. Now that the city is doing their part, EPE needs to do theirs. And the economy isn't as much an issue now as it was 3-5 years ago. And CKX is no longer going broke and is under strong stable ownership in Apollo. So no more excuses can be made.

Time for them to put up or shut up.