Reply With QuoteI agree with what you say, totally.Originally Posted by kathy parkinson
I agree with ya' Mate!
I'm the King of the Jungle, They call me Tigerman
]
I agree with what you say, totally.
"talk about the good times"
My fedora is off to you on this one pal!Yep, I think this year will obviously see a sharp rise in Jackson's posthumous earning power but I don't think his legacy is sustainable in the way that Elvis's is, for reasons which I've already raised on other MJ-related threads here.
One of the main reasons is that there's just a lot less product to peddle in terms of recorded material. Elvis's catalogue of music and film is vast compared to Jackson's and any rumors you've heard about vaults full of Thriller-standard Jacko music have to be absolute nonsense. Sure, there will probably be some decent unfinished tracks which are no-doubt being hastily shopped around marketable collaborators for remixing as I write, but if they were in such great supply and presentable form, then rest assured you would have heard them already- Sony do actually want to make back some of the fortune they spent on the guy in recent years and they haven't been waiting for him to die to do it, all cynicism aside.
Also, Elvis's ability to crossover markets is greater than Jackson's. As an interpretive singer, Elvis took pride in his adaptability of style and breadth of range as he tackled material from a huge variety of sources throughout his career. By contrast the adult Jackson was a relative one-trick-pony, albeit an instantly-recognizable and brilliant trick, depending upon how much you appreciate breathy squeaks and ubiquitous "hee-heeee"s. This might not seem that important, but when you consider the manner in which expired vocalists' performances are sold and consumed in recent years, often alongside a current artist in a completely different audio environment than the original recording, then Elvis' flexibility becomes an attractive asset. I'm not saying that posthumous collaborations aren't available to Michael, only that they're just as limited as his back-catalogue.
Speaking of which, most people who weren't massive fans, but still liked Michael enough to not be put off by the child-molestation allegations, bought his 2003 'Number Ones' package at the time, and the ones who didn't acquired the content shortly after discovering he was dead, so that's a massive potential market who've already shot-their-bolt as far as his sales of existing music is concerned for quite a while. Of course music can be 'sold' in different ways- we'll get around to that later.
As for the child-molestation itself, while he was never actually convicted of such a thing, and the majority 'on the fence' about his alleged guilt have adopted a selective amnesia for the purpose of his mourning, I suspect that this is a temporary atmosphere of clemency. Now that the funereal circus is over, there is already a kind of stunned apathy emerging which is likely to give way to the same old misgivings about his suspected guilt. Except worse, because people are beginning to feel guilty themselves for eulogizing him. That really doesn't bode well for long-term marketability. You only have to talk to the man in the street.
This unfortunate association originally kept product endorsements at bay and Jackson almost completely off the radio for years, so in the obvious absence of any forthcoming live appearances, and most domestic music consumers already in possession of any tracks which they were ever likely to buy, the salability of his music is greatly compromised, despite any residual acceptance while he isn't presenting any immediate threat to children(!)
Remember, from a 'profile' perspective, Michael's alleged child-abuse has been more relevant than his music since 1993. That's almost the duration of the entire second half of his solo career.
If Graceland relied exclusively upon hardcore Elvis fans to make up it's attendance figures it probably would have closed years ago. It remains one of the most successful tourist attractions of all time because there's something about Elvis which appeals even to those who aren't yet fully initiated. At the very least, even non-fans can say they've visited the famous home of the world's original pioneer of popular music. Compare this to the Jacko connotations which almost prohibit his music from a significant proportion of the people who actually like it. Who wants to say they visited 'the infamous suspected crime-scene of the world's highest-profile alleged pedophile'? I really don't see Neverland replicating Graceland's enduring success, since even a faction of his most stalwart fans consider it his nemesis.
Plans for releasing footage of the This Is It rehearsals have a limited shelf-life of profitability, since the sequences were not intended for public consumption and therefore deliberately 'underperformed' to conserve what remained of Jackson's energy for the actual shows. After the initial morbid curiosity has been satisfied, there is unlikely to be a lucrative long-term appeal to the content. We're not talking about the Comeback Special or Aloha here. It's going to be hard enough to package it, never mind re-package it!
For what it's worth, I thought Michael Jackson was an amazing artist and I always had serious doubts about his guilt, but the question here is about his posthumous earning potential, and this is what we have to work with. Especially while he doesn't own the exclusive rights on sales of sequined gloves and fedora hats.
Last edited by The King's Queen; 08-18-2009 at 08:26 AM.
Daddy, I miss you more every day. You will always be my hero..
My fedora is off to you on this one pal!Thanks
'Taking Care of Beaulieu'.
So, was that a "no" then teddy?Yep, I think this year will obviously see a sharp rise in Jackson's posthumous earning power but I don't think his legacy is sustainable in the way that Elvis's is, for reasons which I've already raised on other MJ-related threads here.
One of the main reasons is that there's just a lot less product to peddle in terms of recorded material. Elvis's catalogue of music and film is vast compared to Jackson's and any rumors you've heard about vaults full of Thriller-standard Jacko music have to be absolute nonsense. Sure, there will probably be some decent unfinished tracks which are no-doubt being hastily shopped around marketable collaborators for remixing as I write, but if they were in such great supply and presentable form, then rest assured you would have heard them already- Sony do actually want to make back some of the fortune they spent on the guy in recent years and they haven't been waiting for him to die to do it, all cynicism aside.
Also, Elvis's ability to crossover markets is greater than Jackson's. As an interpretive singer, Elvis took pride in his adaptability of style and breadth of range as he tackled material from a huge variety of sources throughout his career. By contrast the adult Jackson was a relative one-trick-pony, albeit an instantly-recognizable and brilliant trick, depending upon how much you appreciate breathy squeaks and ubiquitous "hee-heeee"s. This might not seem that important, but when you consider the manner in which expired vocalists' performances are sold and consumed in recent years, often alongside a current artist in a completely different audio environment than the original recording, then Elvis' flexibility becomes an attractive asset. I'm not saying that posthumous collaborations aren't available to Michael, only that they're just as limited as his back-catalogue.
Speaking of which, most people who weren't massive fans, but still liked Michael enough to not be put off by the child-molestation allegations, bought his 2003 'Number Ones' package at the time, and the ones who didn't acquired the content shortly after discovering he was dead, so that's a massive potential market who've already shot-their-bolt as far as his sales of existing music is concerned for quite a while. Of course music can be 'sold' in different ways- we'll get around to that later.
As for the child-molestation itself, while he was never actually convicted of such a thing, and the majority 'on the fence' about his alleged guilt have adopted a selective amnesia for the purpose of his mourning, I suspect that this is a temporary atmosphere of clemency. Now that the funereal circus is over, there is already a kind of stunned apathy emerging which is likely to give way to the same old misgivings about his suspected guilt. Except worse, because people are beginning to feel guilty themselves for eulogizing him. That really doesn't bode well for long-term marketability. You only have to talk to the man in the street.
This unfortunate association originally kept product endorsements at bay and Jackson almost completely off the radio for years, so in the obvious absence of any forthcoming live appearances, and most domestic music consumers already in possession of any tracks which they were ever likely to buy, the salability of his music is greatly compromised, despite any residual acceptance while he isn't presenting any immediate threat to children(!)
Remember, from a 'profile' perspective, Michael's alleged child-abuse has been more relevant than his music since 1993. That's almost the duration of the entire second half of his solo career.
If Graceland relied exclusively upon hardcore Elvis fans to make up it's attendance figures it probably would have closed years ago. It remains one of the most successful tourist attractions of all time because there's something about Elvis which appeals even to those who aren't yet fully initiated. At the very least, even non-fans can say they've visited the famous home of the world's original pioneer of popular music. Compare this to the Jacko connotations which almost prohibit his music from a significant proportion of the people who actually like it. Who wants to say they visited 'the infamous suspected crime-scene of the world's highest-profile alleged pedophile'? I really don't see Neverland replicating Graceland's enduring success, since even a faction of his most stalwart fans consider it his nemesis.
Plans for releasing footage of the This Is It rehearsals have a limited shelf-life of profitability, since the sequences were not intended for public consumption and therefore deliberately 'underperformed' to conserve what remained of Jackson's energy for the actual shows. After the initial morbid curiosity has been satisfied, there is unlikely to be a lucrative long-term appeal to the content. We're not talking about the Comeback Special or Aloha here. It's going to be hard enough to package it, never mind re-package it!
For what it's worth, I thought Michael Jackson was an amazing artist and I always had serious doubts about his guilt, but the question here is about his posthumous earning potential, and this is what we have to work with. Especially while he doesn't own the exclusive rights on sales of sequined gloves and fedora hats.
Something like thatSo, was that a "no" then teddy?
Hey, I was bedridden for days and this was the first thread I saw.
I totally agree with you,Kathy!
I dont think
Cracking post Teddy, very well put
Deb
"NO-ONE, BUT NO-ONE,IS HIS EQUAL, OR EVER WILL BE. HE WAS, AND IS SUPREME".Mick Jagger
Well put, Teddy, and NO, MJ will not surpass Elvis after this first year. Any more than Kurt Cobain [who?] or John Lennon.
Now then, will everyone be making fun of MJ's sequined socks, glove and outer thong as they do the Elvis jumpsuit?
Just pretend, I'm holding you, and whispering things soft and low.
And think of me, how it's gonna be and just pretend I didn't go
You do have a point there!
I can't say I've thought about it in that way!!!
Kurt Cobain's widow Courtney Love sold part of his sold catalog for 50 million that resulted in him beating Elvis for one year back in 2005.
A rhetorical question, Brian.
Well that depends, things cost more these days.
oh, I thought you meant the part of your post that was rhetorical was asking who Kurt Cobain was.
Just curious, Brian, what # did K C fall to in 2006? Do you know?
Just pretend, I'm holding you, and whispering things soft and low.
And think of me, how it's gonna be and just pretend I didn't go
That might be the perfect marketing tool-Pepper for the early years and salt for the later "remade MJ"......
I think Joe Jackson is money hungry and I can see him squeezing every last dollar out of any situation which will make money.
Its my understanding that MJ had hundreds of unreleased songs in the can-which could be the difference in who makes the most each year.
But we will see how loyal and long lasting the fans of MJ are in the next 10 years.
Work in Progress!
Oh yeah
Diane
Just pretend, I'm holding you, and whispering things soft and low.
And think of me, how it's gonna be and just pretend I didn't go
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