Colonel Parker's 'Hold'...

[NEA]

Hi Guys,

I was in conversation with an older gentleman today who is a big Elvis fan and we got to talking about Colonel Parker's managerial tactics regarding EP. The gentleman suddenly stated that there was a speculating rumour about Colonel's so-called 'hold' over Elvis and his career - the rumour goes something like this:

Elvis had accidentally killed a person in a car-crash early on his career and The Colonel was the only witness to this, and so began the tug of emotional blackmail...

Now, I could have heard this rumour many years ago - I can't 100% remember...what do you think guys?

Intriguing?

NEA.

[Tommy]

I don't believe it (n)

Thanks for posting,

Tommy :)

[NEA]

My thoughts exactly, Tommy.

[Jungleroom76]

I've NEVER heard this story either... :hmm:

As far as I know, the only reason Elvis kept The Colonel around as his manager was because of Elvis' deep sense of loyalty to The Colonel for making Elvis a superstar!! Elvis always felt that, without The Colonel, no one would have heard of Elvis Presley on an international level!! Of course, Sam Phillips was the man who truly "discovered" Elvis, but it was Col. Parker who got Elvis the record deal with RCA, got Elvis booked on all of the hot TV shows of the 1950's (The Dorsey Bros. Stage Show, Ed Sullivan, etc.), brokered Elvis' movie deals, etc. And without all of that, Elvis figured he would have just been a regional success at best. So it is because of all of The Colonel's early dealings on Elvis' behalf which helped catapult Elvis to superstardom, that Elvis felt such a strong sense of loyalty to The Colonel. And despite the many questionable managerial decisions that The Colonel made from roughly the mid-60's until Elvis' death, Elvis kept The Colonel on as his manager! Plus, of course, there is the well-known moment during the 60's (that was documented in the CBS mini-series ELVIS earlier this year) when Elvis planned on firing The Colonel, but was faced with such a high price to buy out The Colonel's contract, that he just dropped the whole idea and kept The Colonel on. Now THAT was blackmail!!! :angry:

Of course the reason that The Colonel stuck with Elvis is quite simple...

MONEY!!!!
MONEY!!!!
MONEY!!!! :cursing:

That is indeed an interesting rumor, though NEA!!! :hmm:

TCB!
Mike

[0349054]

Yeah the Colonel wanted a payment of 1 million, he said it was money owed to him by Elvis. Neither Elvis or Vernon were good at that kind of stuff, and that price scared them. The Colonel knew that Elvis thought he was passed it in the 70's. The 'hold' was originally out of loyalty and then in the end due to financial reasons. That car crash thing never happened, its as crazy as that book that claims the hold was due to Elvis having slept with men! And Elvis was a complete homophobe.

[Leroy]

A friend of mine went to a meeting some days ago where the Imperials were guests of honor. He had a conversation with Terry Blackwood about Elvis' love for Gospel music. He asked him why Elvis didn't record more Gospel not only because of his love for it but also because the only Grammy's he won was with Gospel material. Terry stated that the Colonel did not agree with Elvis doing Gospel. He even added a clausule into the contract to prevent Elvis of recording more Gospel.

By the way, the reason the Colonel stuck with Elvis was not money alone; it was also power. Power to manipulate the record- and movie industry.

[0349054]

I didn't know about any clause regarding the recording of Gospel Music in Elvis' contract. If such a clause was in the contract, then I wonder when was it inserted. You said Terry Blackwood said to prevent him recoding more Gospel, so then it's probabaly after, "He Touched Me", which it is true that we got no more Gospel Albums after that. Maybe during 1974, when Elvis and The Colonel briefly fired each other and The Colonel hit Elvis with the $1 million bill, he inserted a new clause in the contract, because he re-negotiated the contract before he would go back to work for Elvis. The only thing I knew about that new contract the differed from the previous one, was that it was now 50/50.

The Colonel did plenty of side deals with RCA over the years. I don't know if Elvis knew or if it's true. John Moran, Tom Jones'
publicist in the early 80's told one of the guys that Parker tried to sell the contract to Tom's manager but I don't know if any of that is true.

But you cant sell the contract without the artists permission.


Because Elvis didn't know much about business he deferred and relied on
The Colonel for that part of it. Parker or Elvis could have fired each other
as they did briefly in '74 but he couldn't sell the contract.


Some of the guys think he was behind the vendors selling stuff to the people outside the gate, after Elvis died.
Elvis' body wasn't even cold before he made a merchandising deal with
factors and during the funeral got Vernon to sign the contract.

There was a talk in the University of Memphis, about Elvis and The Colonel. It started by exploring whether Elvis could have been famous without The Colonel and concluded that Elvis succeeded inspite of The Colonel. Gladys never liked him, and I think her judgement was spot on.

[eap1977]

Hi Guys,

I was in conversation with an older gentleman today who is a big Elvis fan and we got to talking about Colonel Parker's managerial tactics regarding EP. The gentleman suddenly stated that there was a speculating rumour about Colonel's so-called 'hold' over Elvis and his career - the rumour goes something like this:

Elvis had accidentally killed a person in a car-crash early on his career and The Colonel was the only witness to this, and so began the tug of emotional blackmail...

Now, I could have heard this rumour many years ago - I can't 100% remember...what do you think guys?

Intriguing?

NEA.

Hi guys!

I read somewhere that when Elvis came back from the army that his cousin (I believe) had recorded with a new movie camera Elvis and 3 or 4 teenage girls at Graceland in some compromising situations and that the Col got a hold of this, can't remember which trash biography this cam from.:angry:

Whatever the reasons (as they were probably more that we can know or understand) they were there and very strong! It's so easy from our distance to say Elvis should have seen this or that but 20/20 vision comes from hindsight. Sometimes I sit around and daydream about what could have been if only...

[Wendy56]

There's no way this story can be true (!!!) :mad: NO-WAY (n)

[KPM]

I didn't know about any clause regarding the recording of Gospel Music in Elvis' contract. If such a clause was in the contract, then I wonder when was it inserted. You said Terry Blackwood said to prevent him recoding more Gospel, so then it's probabaly after, "He Touched Me", which it is true that we got no more Gospel Albums after that. Maybe during 1974, when Elvis and The Colonel briefly fired each other and The Colonel hit Elvis with the $1 million bill, he inserted a new clause in the contract, because he re-negotiated the contract before he would go back to work for Elvis. The only thing I knew about that new contract the differed from the previous one, was that it was now 50/50.

The Colonel did plenty of side deals with RCA over the years. I don't know if Elvis knew or if it's true. John Moran, Tom Jones'
publicist in the early 80's told one of the guys that Parker tried to sell the contract to Tom's manager but I don't know if any of that is true.

But you cant sell the contract without the artists permission.


Because Elvis didn't know much about business he deferred and relied on
The Colonel for that part of it. Parker or Elvis could have fired each other
as they did briefly in '74 but he couldn't sell the contract.


Some of the guys think he was behind the vendors selling stuff to the people outside the gate, after Elvis died.
Elvis' body wasn't even cold before he made a merchandising deal with
factors and during the funeral got Vernon to sign the contract.

There was a talk in the University of Memphis, about Elvis and The Colonel. It started by exploring whether Elvis could have been famous without The Colonel and concluded that Elvis succeeded inspite of The Colonel. Gladys never liked him, and I think her judgement was spot on.
The Col. was security to Elvis and he felt loyalty also. Elvis was notorious for avoiding big decisions. He should have stuck it out and paid off the COl. the one time got fed up. As far as I know and have read Elvis recorded, after 1969, whatever he wanted to. The trouble was he did not want to record very often. I'm sure RCA and Parker would have loved a gospel album in 76 and 77 if they could have got him into a studio for more than a day or so.

[0349054]

Yeah, thing is as you said, he just wouldent go to a studio. I asked one of the MM, and the clause regarding Gospel Music, never existed, the Colonel had no say over the type of music Elvis recorded - that's not to say he didn't feed him rubbish material from the publishing comapnies though.

[NEA]

Once again, the likes of Priscilla in "Elvis By The Presleys" and a number of 'close' friends of Elvis have been contradicted about Elvis & The Colonel's business relationship - Parker did not agree with Elvis recording Gospel music, so much so that he had a clause written into their contract.

More creative indifference and interference...Business As Usual.

[0349054]

I'm fairly sure there was no clause in the contract. NEA, where are you getting the information regarding a clause in the contract from, just out of curiosity? And when was it inserted? I've asked two of the MM, and neither knew anything about it or believed it could exist.:blink:

[NEA]

Hi 0349054,

I was merely quoting a rumour that was used in an earlier post on this thread, and using it as a contradiction in terms.

You asked two members of the Memphis Mafia about this?...the only problem here is that Sonny West can tell 'his' theory and Charlie Hodge could tell you 'his' theory...and then, there's David Stanley's theory...and so on...who do you believe?

It's a crap-shoot...I say you've got to go with your own instincts after your research - anybody who was 'close' to Elvis are all consistently unreliable if you ask me, as they just love to re-write history because that promotes them as the number one insider and helps pay the bills for another little while.

Nevertheless, just my opinion.

NEA.

[0349054]

I agree with you for the most part. Its better to take all the accounts and derive your own conclusion from that. But something like a contract clause, well, the guys have no advantage in lying. I'm just wondering where that rumour started, because I cant see how it could ever be true. I just dont believe it. And it wasnt Sonny or Charlie, and Stanley - don't get me started on the Stanley's! Thanks though for the quick reply NEA.

[Jungleroom76]

You asked two members of the Memphis Mafia about this?...the only problem here is that Sonny West can tell 'his' theory and Charlie Hodge could tell you 'his' theory...and then, there's David Stanley's theory...and so on...who do you believe?

It's a crap-shoot...I say you've got to go with your own instincts after your research - anybody who was 'close' to Elvis are all consistently unreliable if you ask me, as they just love to re-write history because that promotes them as the number one insider and helps pay the bills for another little while.

COULDN'T HAVE SAID IT BETTER MYSELF NEA!!! (y)

It would be so interesting to pick one particular story (choosing a story that is pretty well documented) and then ask each of the guys that were around Elvis to share their memories of that story, and compare them to each other and see just how far off each one was and how each person spins the story to make sure that they are the main person in the story with Elvis!!! :hmm:

THAT would be an interesting study.... :blink:

TCB!
Mike

[KPM]

I recall I read somewhere that Elvis was contractually obligated for a Gospel album after 1971 but I for the life of me can not recall which book I read it in.
Lets face it the Col. wanted money rolling in and if a Gospel album would do it he would not turn it down. I think its obvious that after If I Can Dream Elvis was calling the shots about what music and when. The Col. was sending Elvis reminders all the time about how many new singles and albums he was suppose to cut each year and Elvis, it seems , ignored them for the most part. If he could not even force him into the studio how could he force a NO GOSPEL clause that would have only ticked off Elvis even more.
I know you've all heard how Steve Sholes told the Jordanaires not to sing gospel in 56 if it would slow down sessions. When Elvis finally was told why they would not join in on gospel jams, he let everyone know he would sing what he wanted until he was ready to record-and that was the end of that.

[0349054]

I know a lot is said about the MM, but theres only a few members who tell howlers. The real, core of the Memphis Mafia, from the 50's normally agree with each other on what happened. I tend to believe them, but I also tend to believe that Elvis was muti-faceted and quite a complex person, so it is hard to describe him. Basically its up to everyone what they believe, but I trust the guys more than authors who are basing their work on secondhand interviews with the guys and on books written by people who didnt know Elvis.

For instance, while Guarnlicks books are very good, he wrote them for the Estate, and used, Priscillas book, "Elvis and Me", as one of his sources. That book, is quite ficitonal. But thats getting into everything, like Priscilla says that her father never forced Elvis to marry her, but I don't tend to believe that. I tend to beliveve that Elvis was somewhat forced into that marriage, and everyone knows he thought so highly of Ann-Margaret. I think, had Elvis and Ann-Margaret wed, then Elvis would still be with us.:king:

[0349054]

I recall I read somewhere that Elvis was contractually obligated for a Gospel album after 1971 but I for the life of me can not recall which book I read it in.
Lets face it the Col. wanted money rolling in and if a Gospel album would do it he would not turn it down. I think its obvious that after If I Can Dream Elvis was calling the shots about what music and when. The Col. was sending Elvis reminders all the time about how many new singles and albums he was suppose to cut each year and Elvis, it seems , ignored them for the most part. If he could not even force him into the studio how could he force a NO GOSPEL clause that would have only ticked off Elvis even more.
I know you've all heard how Steve Sholes told the Jordanaires not to sing gospel in 56 if it would slow down sessions. When Elvis finally was told why they would not join in on gospel jams, he let everyone know he would sing what he wanted until he was ready to record-and that was the end of that.

Completely agree. I cant see Elvis ever agreeing to such a clause, or ever abiding by it. His concerts in the late 70's were more country and gospel than rock and roll. As he said, he couldent see himself rocking to Hound Dog or Blue Suede Shoes much longer.

[Jungleroom76]

I think, had Elvis and Ann-Margaret wed, then Elvis would still be with us.:king:

I AGREE WITH YOU COMPLETELY!!! (y)

I also think that if Elvis had married Linda Thompson, he would still be with us too!!

TCB!
Mike

[0349054]

Yes Linda also. I do hope that someday she writes a book about Elvis.

[Leroy]

I would rather believe someone from Elvis' musical entourage than a MM member. Although some of them, like Jerry Shilling for instance, were very loyal to Elvis during his life time, most of them turned very commercial after 1977.

Another point is that Elvis did not discuss every detail with his inner circle especially when it had something to do with his relationship with the Colonel. He could never be sure who would go around behind his back.

However with his fellow musicians like the Imperials or the Stamps he could talk easily about his frustrations especially if it would concern Gospel music.
And don't forget the Colonel did try to prevent him several times recording specific songs. Remember the arguing about Suspicious Minds?? If Tom Diskin was't there on the spot we might never heard of the song. And that's just an argument that leaked out. I'm pretty sure there are more stories in the same line.

When my friend approached the Imperials it was because he wanted them to autograph his picture. Because they are very friendly and interested in their fans and Elvis' fans my friend was able to start a conversation and just out of curisosity and being an admirer of Elvis Gospel music he asked about it. He could never imagine he would get this kind of answer from Terry Blackwood.
I can imagine easily that the members of the Imperials, who worked on both Elvis? awarded Gospel albums might have asked Elvis the same question.

[0349054]

I see what your saying Leroy, but I do feel that I feel that his friends are more reliable than the musicians. Regardless, it is a strange response from Terry Blackwood. I just find it so bizzare, I can't see Elvis ever allowing such a clause from the Colonel. Especially with plans in 74' for a Gospel TV special. I'm not syaing the Colonel didn't try and interfere, but usually it was to do with what cut he could get out of the song financially.

[KPM]

The Col. may have argued with Elvis over a lot of things- but lets face it he recorded Suspicious Minds despite the Col. and it was a hit. He loved Gospel music more than any other, if you believe his own words, so its hard for me to fathom he would ever allow such a thing. Also I think the Parker would be smart enough to know that and would never ask for it. Some people thought the Col. hypnotised him, a book that came out in 2002 and (went nowhere) said the Col. had proof Elvis was a homosexual and that was what held him in place. Elvis for all his talent was not a business man. Parker was, and he had got Elvis many good deals, movies, merchandising etc. but in the 70s Parker just did not negotiate for Elvis-he negotiated for himself. Elvis did not fully know it, and trusted him on the basis of the work he did in the 50s&60s. If he had known it maybe it would have been different. There is not always a mysterious answer to such questions as this, like I said loyalty(and bad judgement on Elvis's part)are what held him to the COl. Look at his 70s albums and you find a gospel song on many of them. Talk About the Good TIme, I've Got A feeling in My Body, Life,If That Isn't Love, etc. He recorded them when he wanted to. I just wish whatever he had recorded he had got to the studio more often, Such a shame. As far as Terry saying this maybe he believed it but was just wrong.

[Cryogenic]

The Colonel was far too intelligent a man to stop Elvis recording gospel music - the bedrock of Elvis' life AND a big profit turner to boot! In other words, gospel music was valuable to both men for entirely different but equally powerful reasons. Further, although not many gospel albums were produced, one must put this into its proper context: when a gospel album was made, it was purely gospel (i.e. a high density of material ALL belonging to the same genre) and therefore the well was visited extensively in a short time. Moreover, the spirit of gospel was embodied in almost every song Elvis recorded/performed - no matter the genre - so there was not necessarily a fervent drive for Elvis to churn out gospel album after gospel album. Lastly, as much as Elvis wanted to share his gifts with others, I think gospel was essentially private to him: hence all the gospel-based "warm ups" and "warm downs" he did purely for relaxation and that, by definition, weren't recorded. The application of a little logic goes on a long way when dealing with issues such as this.

[Jungleroom76]

Yes Linda also. I do hope that someday she writes a book about Elvis.

I HOPE SHE DOES TOO!! I BET SHE HAS SOME VERY INTERESTING STORIES TO TELL, AND SHE SEEMS TO BE A NO-NONSENSE TYPE OF PERSON THAT WOULD TELL IT LIKE IT IS, SO TO SPEAK! I DON'T THINK SHE WOULD WRITE A BOOK THAT WOULD SLANT THE STORIES TOWARD MAKING HERSELF LOOK GOOD (AS MANY OTHER PEOPLE FROM THE INNER CIRCLE HAVE DONE THROUGHOUT THE YEARS!)....I TRULY BELIEVE SHE WOULD TELL THE STORIES AS THEY ACTUALLY HAPPENED, GOOD OR BAD!!! :hmm:

TCB!
Mike

[Jungleroom76]

I would rather believe someone from Elvis' musical entourage than a MM member. Although some of them, like Jerry Shilling for instance, were very loyal to Elvis during his life time, most of them turned very commercial after 1977.

Another point is that Elvis did not discuss every detail with his inner circle especially when it had something to do with his relationship with the Colonel. He could never be sure who would go around behind his back.

However with his fellow musicians like the Imperials or the Stamps he could talk easily about his frustrations especially if it would concern Gospel music.
And don't forget the Colonel did try to prevent him several times recording specific songs. Remember the arguing about Suspicious Minds?? If Tom Diskin was't there on the spot we might never heard of the song. And that's just an argument that leaked out. I'm pretty sure there are more stories in the same line.

When my friend approached the Imperials it was because he wanted them to autograph his picture. Because they are very friendly and interested in their fans and Elvis' fans my friend was able to start a conversation and just out of curisosity and being an admirer of Elvis Gospel music he asked about it. He could never imagine he would get this kind of answer from Terry Blackwood.
I can imagine easily that the members of the Imperials, who worked on both Elvis? awarded Gospel albums might have asked Elvis the same question.

EXCELLENT POINTS LEROY!!! (y)

I had the chance to meet Jerry Schilling in Memphis during Elvis Week 2000, and he is such a great guy!! He tells the stories as they happened with no embellishing of the facts! I honestly think he is one of the most reliable storytellers from Elvis' inner circle!!

I also agree with your point that the guys from The Imperials and/or The Stamps probably would also be very reliable in terms of the stories they tell about Elvis....I'm sure that Elvis confided in them often, particularly J.D. Sumner!!!

TCB!
Mike

[Leroy]

I'm affraid a lot of you give the Colonel too much credit. He was not intelligent, he was smart and foxy. That's a difference. He was also not a religion man although he pretended to be. He did a lot of wheelin' and dealin' behind Elvis back and mostly not in favour of Elvis although he used his name. He walked over people. Remember that the 50/50 contract was made up in 1967. For someone who's able to do things like that adding a clausule is easy, almost a daily routine. Elvis just did have no say in this. The "Suspicious Minds Battle" was won not because of Elvis but because of Tom Diskin who recognized a potential hit. And he was one of the few people who was able to go against the Colonel. But he was not always around.

Somewhere in the middle of the sixties the Colonel decided that Elvis' voice was to be mixed more to the front in recordings, something that made Elvis explode. An important part of the Elvis sound was his voice blending with the harmony vocal (also a Gospel trick). He went over to the Colonel's office to fight it and lost. The Colonel did not say what to record or how to record it but simply created the circumstance in a way that Elvis could not do anything else but the Colonel's way. That's the most tricky things of all because that way it looks as though it's Elvis own desicion.

[Lonniebealestreet]

Leroy, it may or may not be true, but I believe it is quite possible that either Terry Blackwood did a little bit of embellishing to your friend there, or Elvis told a tall tale to him.

The first seems logical to me because such stories are in keeping with the position that Colonel controlled Elvis and kept him artistically bankrupt. I am not saying that isn't a true statement, but it is convenient for the estate or us fans to in many cases make Elvis out to be the victim, someone who simply wasn't in control of his own destiny.

I've noticed that just in the last few years the estate has gone from nearly glorifying the Presley-Parker relationship to pointing out all its faults at every opportunity, sometimes misrepresenting things a bit ( :supriced: ).

Terry Blackwood has been involved with several EPE projects, so it makes sense that he would be out there telling the official versions of stories, or those that are in keeping with them.

My other thought was that Elvis may have said something to that effect to the Imperials, perhaps when seeing them after not having worked with them for a few years and they asked him if he had any plans to record any more gospel.

Regardless, to me it seems pretty unlikely that Elvis would have stood for such a restriction. If anything, had there been one, that probably would have prompted a gospel session and a declaration from him that he would record no further music until his gospel music was released!

Also, when would this have happened? Let's see...If That Isn't Love was recorded in the studio in 1973, so it would have been after that. How Great Thou Art was a live recording, but it won a Grammy and it's hard to imagine Elvis being told to record no more gospel after that happening! And when you think of how infrequently Elvis went into a studio subsequent to that--there was actually only one more session in an actual recording studio--it seems very unlikely that anyone would have restricted him in that way when they were so anxious to get new material out of him.

JMO.

[Cryogenic]

Wow!

To use an Elvis word... FANTASTIC points made by all!

Leroy, of course The Colonel was not necessarily smart/intelligent/intellectual in all the ways use of those broad words imply (and yes, he was also a formidable presence - a sneak, a bully boy, a paranoid sociopath) - but he surely knew enough that preventing Elvis from recording gospel material was bad for Elvis and bad for ol' Colonel! Like Lonnie, I don't believe Elvis would have stood for that kind of restriction, anyway! Getting his voice amped up - even if that move alone was antithetical to gospel - was, as you've said, something The Colonel could and did get away with, but I'm really not so sure that a flat-out ban on an entire genre - Elvis' favourite genre - of music was even on the cards. It seems completely self-defeating from almost every angle.

This certainly is an extraordinary claim we're dealing with here. And in the words of Carl Sagan, extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof.

[Lonniebealestreet]

Glad you agree, Cryo.

One last point...Though the project was scrapped, at least for a while there were plans for Elvis to do an Easter TV special in '74, as was indicated on the single for I've Got A Thing About You Baby (*COMING* ELVIS 1974 EASTER TV SPECIAL was the extent of it). Presumably, this would have predominantly featured gospel performances.

I guess someone might say that didn't happen for the very reason of the restrictive clause being added to Elvis' contract, but I highly doubt it. The fact that it was planned in the first place is telling, I believe.

It's a shame that special that didn't happen isn't something in our current DVD rotation, or something that we are waiting to have officially released, like Elvis In Concert.

[Leroy]

Lonnie, I don't think it's about recording a Gospel type song every now and then to put on an album like "Help Me", "If That Isn't Love" or "Talk About The Good Times". It's about recording Gospel albums.
Off course even Parker had to admit Gospel and Spirituals were always at the base of every piece of music Elvis ever recorded. And on stage Elvis dictated the music. On the other hand remains the fact Elvis never recorded a full Gospel album again despite the success of the awarded "How Great Thou Art" and "He Touched Me".
It was very hard to get Elvis into the studio in the second part of the seventies. The thought of recording a new album with his favourite music could have turn the events. If the Colonel was the manager he ought to be he should have recognized this

[0349054]

Well while I don't believe in the clause, the time between How Great Thou Art and He Touched Me, was roughly 5 years. How Great Thou Art was recorded in May 66' I believe and released in 67'? Not sure if it was late 66' or 67' think 67' though. He Touched Me won a grammy in 72', so we can say about 5 years. 72'-77' is the same 5 year gap, coupled with an Elvis who wasnt that motivated to record anything. I don't think he was prevented from doing an album, I think he just didn't do one.

The reason the TV Special in 74' never happened is because some ***** based its popularity on a re-run of Aloha, which basically everyone had seen, and unless I'm a huge fan of someone I'm not going to watch the same TV special from a year earlier again, ( except Elvis ) and I think thats the reason the re-run didn't pull in big numbers.

[KPM]

The real mystery is not gospel albums, its why was Elvis so hesitant to record?
I think maybe he needed another challenge there also, Jerry Lee Lewis went to London and did an album called" Session" in 1970 I think. Chuck Berry also went to London and did one similar to it. They used great players from, at the time, current popular rock. Klaus Voorman, Ringo Starr,Albert Lee, Alvin Lee Peter Frampton etc... My dream is that Elvis would go into the studio with McCartney,or someone of his talent, as producer and have Clapton, Harrison and other rock heavyweights to set in on the cuts. I think if he could have got excited about going in with people he inspired, maybe it would have got his fire back for recording. Unfortunately he just avoided it for whatever reason. Maybe with touring and Vegas he just did not want anymore of a workload. Maybe being told all the time he had to have 3 singles and an album a year he felt pushed and it was his way or saying don't push me. Sad

[Lonniebealestreet]

Lonnie, I don't think it's about recording a Gospel type song every now and then to put on an album like "Help Me", "If That Isn't Love" or "Talk About The Good Times". It's about recording Gospel albums.
I see. I'm still skeptical but thanks for pointing that out.

KPM, that scenario sounds wonderful to me too, and would have given Elvis much more critical appreciation for his later years. But I think his insecurity would have prevented that from ever happening. When Elvis met the Beatles, I think it was John who asked why he didn't go "back to his old style of record." I'm sure that type of comment bothered him. And in the seventies, working with the chart-toppers of the day who were probably most familiar with his earlier sound and songs would have meant inevitable comparisions, spoken or otherwise. I don't think he would have liked that too much.

[KPM]

I see. I'm still skeptical but thanks for pointing that out.

KPM, that scenario sounds wonderful to me too, and would have given Elvis much more critical appreciation for his later years. But I think his insecurity would have prevented that from ever happening. When Elvis met the Beatles, I think it was John who asked why he didn't go "back to his old style of record." I'm sure that type of comment bothered him. And in the seventies, working with the chart-toppers of the day who were probably most familiar with his earlier sound and songs would have meant inevitable comparisions, spoken or otherwise. I don't think he would have liked that too much.
Thats exactly right, I think he worried that they thought of him as a joke in the
60s, remember he was 30 and no one thought you could stay in rock past 30 back then. So maybe he did feel a little out of the loop. Its funny when he did meet other rockers in the 70s, I think he felt more secure since he was selling out every place he went and was seeing not just older fans but many teenagers.
In 76 when I saw him there were just as many teeny boppers as people my age and older. Plus some acts , like Zepplin, were out and out fans who wanted him to know it. But he just was never really at ease with other stars or bands(with a very few exceptions)

[Cryogenic]

This is all fascinating in its own right.

One thing I'm still struggling with... Was Elvis ill at ease with most music people or did he simply feel indifferent to them? If it's the former (though I suspect it's a bit of both), then that says something profound about his character. Not meaning to criticise or generalise at all - but people within the field of music can be pretty passsionate and opinionated. Maybe it was all a bit too rich for Elvis. I kinda like that idea. Although reverence is on a different scale to simply liking (i.e. I'm going off on a slight tangent), Elvis reserved true reverence for few. Roy Hamilton is about the only one that springs easily to mind.

Anyway, returning to the issue of gospel music...

Elvis might have told his backing singers a white lie. Remember back to the 1972 MSG press conference. Paraphrasing: "Oh, so Elvis, why haven't you recorded much rock 'n roll recently?..." "Well, sir... it's hard to come by good rock material". While there was probably some truth in that - the musical landscape had shifted and the rock 'n roll now making the rounds was very different to what Elvis started with - I think he was also being a little dishonest about his own feelings. If only he could have said that, yes, he still liked rock 'n roll, but no, it wasn't a central concern for him anymore.

Something similar might be going on with this latest anecdote. Now, I'm not for one moment suggesting Elvis cared less for gospel all of a sudden - heck, no! - but that his enthusiasm for recording in general had slid and gospel suffered as much as any other genre. Perhaps, in some senses, gospel actually suffered MORE. For gospel music was always something Elvis treated with the utmost respect. Thus, if his drive for recording as a whole had diminished, there was probably no way in his mind he would be doing gospel unless he felt he could give it 110%. So, why did he do it on stage? Well, it seems pretty evident to me that live performances and audiences stirred something in him that the cramped confines of a studio couldn't; his last Grammy was for a LIVE performance of a gospel song, afterall. Felton Jarvis could barely budge Elvis on the issue of studio-based albums in his closing years. The stage was where Elvis wanted to be and the stage was where he gave some of his best twilight performances.

Just a little more food for thought.

[Menwithbrokenhearts]

There is so much interesting information and comments on this thread I don't know where to begin. Although I do have to agree that Elvis not doing any more gospel albums had more to do with his inability to get into the studio and lack of enthusiasm than a supposed clause. The Colonel truly had a hold on him, and I think Elvis was very insecure about how he would do if the Colonel left. Vernon and Elvis had virtually no experience in this aspect of his career, always deferring to the Col. because that is what he did best. We also have to remember that Elvis wasn't exactly selling alot of albums ( compared to early on) late in his career, which could have added to the insecurities and gave the Col. more ammunition with Elvis as in "It's you that decides the album content and look how well that's doing! YOu let me handle all the rest and we'll pay the bills" kind of thing.
Elvis did know what was going on though as is evident in the famous Red West phone call where Elvis talks about the Col. losing touch with Elvis, and being only about the money. He was stuck, or atleast he felt so. All of which added to all else; the book, his little girl gone, the lawsuits, paternity suits, slow record sales, father's health, increased medicine intake, all the ailments and health problems, I could go on and on. Noone could help him, or would help him.
Ok, I went off on a tangent there, sorry. I just get upset talking about the Col. and all the people that used him. He was like an organ donor hooked up to a life support system and everytime someone needed an organ they just came and took it until there was nothing left. Thank God he had performing to look forward to. He truly did love that.

[Jungleroom76]

O.K....I've been reading all of your posts here and trying to soak everything in, so forgive me if I say/ask something here that has already been addressed above...

The one BIG thing I wonder....if Elvis truly wanted to record another gospel album, why didn't he simply do it? After the Stax Sessions in 1973, Elvis would only step foot into a recording studio once more in March, 1975 for the TODAY sessions. After that, he had no interest in going back to a recording studio again and had to have the recording studio come to him in 1976 for the Jungle Room Sessions. BUT WHY didn't Elvis just announce that he wanted to record a new gospel album and just go into the studio and do it? I can't believe that Elvis wouldn't have gone to a recording studio to record a new gospel album if the opportunity presented itself. But what is the reason for Elvis not simply saying "I want to do a new gospel album, and I'm going to do it period!" Of course, we all know that Elvis didn't like standing up to The Colonel, and this probably was the main reason....and I'm not saying that there is some underlying restriction or "deal" (so to speak) that would keep Elvis from recording a new gospel album. But if The Colonel was such a con man, why didn't he tell Elvis "look, you go into the studio and record some tracks for a new non-gospel album, and while you are in the studio, you can record some tracks for a new gospel album too!"? :hmm: This way, Elvis' RCA contract for new recordings was fulfilled by having him record in an actual studio!! Let's face it, I am sure that having all the recording equipment moved into Graceland for the Jungle Room Sessions in 1976 was probably an expensive project....one that most likely cut into The Colonel's profits somehow. I can't believe RCA would simply absorb all of the cost of moving all that equipment to Graceland, without taking some of the cost out of the profits from the recordings that was paid to Elvis and The Colonel. Maybe I'm overanalyzing this too much... :hmm:

Just a thought....sorry if it sounds a bit disorganized.... :blink:

TCB!
Mike

[0349054]

Elvis by the late 70's was depressed. I don't think he had any desire to record. He was depressed and struggling with a prescription drug dependency and a fluctuating weight problem as well as ever more increasing visits to hospitals. I don't think he wanted to record anything, so I doubt it was a concious decision to alienate a prospective Gospel album.

Elvis wanted Tom Hulett or Jerry Weintarub to be his manager after the 74' disagreement, and it's a pity he never hired one of them. He should of payed the Colonel his dues, and bid the old money sucker farewell once and for all. As for RCA moving everything into Gracelabd, Elvis really wasnt that bothered to record even when they came. It was difficult for them to get him to come down and record and even when he did he was easily distracted. January 77' in Nashiville shows how little he cared for recording at this stage.

[KPM]

Elvis by the late 70's was depressed. I don't think he had any desire to record. He was depressed and struggling with a prescription drug dependency and a fluctuating weight problem as well as ever more increasing visits to hospitals. I don't think he wanted to record anything, so I doubt it was a concious decision to alienate a prospective Gospel album.

Elvis wanted Tom Hulett or Jerry Weintarub to be his manager after the 74' disagreement, and it's a pity he never hired one of them. He should of payed the Colonel his dues, and bid the old money sucker farewell once and for all. As for RCA moving everything into Gracelabd, Elvis really wasnt that bothered to record even when they came. It was difficult for them to get him to come down and record and even when he did he was easily distracted. January 77' in Nashiville shows how little he cared for recording at this stage.

Thats a great point, we are not talking about Elvis of 72 or 73 who still was into his music, we are talking about a man who was tired, depressed and seeing alot of personal things change for the worse. Elvis did not like change, thats why he got into ruts so easily. Its hard to be ELVIS 24 hours a day when you are young and everything is new and exciting try it at 39 where you've seen it all, done it all, and are probably wondering -what now.

[Jungleroom76]

EXCELLENT POINT KPM... :hmm:

TCB!
Mike

[1100ccRider]

The hold that Colonel had over Elvis stems from an incident involving a trio of little people (a.k.a. midgets), three size small football helmets, several bottles of Crisco, a human-cannonball style of cannon, and severe damage to the roof of Ellis Auditorium. One result of the ensuing coverup was Billy Barty's recurring role in Elvis' '60s movies.

It's true. David Stanley told me.

[KPM]

The hold that Colonel had over Elvis stems from an incident involving a trio of little people (a.k.a. midgets), three size small football helmets, several bottles of Crisco, a human-cannonball style of cannon, and severe damage to the roof of Ellis Auditorium. One result of the ensuing coverup was Billy Barty's recurring role in Elvis' '60s movies.

It's true. David Stanley told me.

I'm sure that will be in his next book," From Memphis to Crisco"(more stories that almost happened.

[KPM]

Heres the text of a telegram Elvis sent to Col Parker after Parker arranged for Presley to sign with RCA Records, Elvis told him, in a telegram,

You are the best, most wonderful person I could ever hope to work with. Believe me when I say I will stick with you through thick and thin and do everything I can to uphold your faith in me.... I love you like a father.

[Menwithbrokenhearts]

Has anyone heard this? In the book "The boy who would be King", Earl Greenwood (Elvis' cousin and supposed life long friend" says that Elvis confided in him that the reason THe Col. had him " by the balls" was because The Col. had confiscated several video tapes of Elvis "with" underage groupies early in his career and always threatened to release them to the public, or Elvis was scared he would, if he strayed from the Colonel.
Another case of someone in the Elvis chain trying to make a buck, or is there any substance to this story?
thanks

[NEA]

Earl Greenwood...familiar name...which cousin was this...whose side does he stem from?

Nevertheless, if HE hadn't said it then it would have been left for the likes of David Stanley, Sonny West, Dick Grob, etc. to explore...hey-hum...

Next!

[joanne]

I wouldn`t believe a word that comes out of Earl Greenwoods mouth.
The thing thats always bothered me regarding Elvis and the Colonel is why did Elvis sign another film contract in the early sixties when he obviously knew which direction he was going and he was starting to become dissatisfied with the movies he was making.

[0349054]

Earl Greenwood is in no way related to Elvis Presley. He never lived in Tupeol MS and never worked for Elvis. What he did do was read other books and then taking from them constructed his one. No one in the Elvis world takes him seriously or believes his book. He's not related! A bogus!

His claim to fame is he hung around the Graceland gates in the 50's and was allowed to go to some parties.Some of his "made up" stories border on the absolutely laughable. Like the Tupelo Tornado story. Or the double dates with Elvis and Dixie Locke.

I believe it knocked Gail Brewer Girogios book off the No.1 spot for Elvis books in the fiction category.

[THENATUREBOY]

My feelings on the Colonel are mixed. The down side of the Colonel is that he held Elvis back artistically so much that it is sad. But the up side to their relationship, well just look at what level Elvis's star had reached when he died. But the hold the Colonel had on him is I think, is the weirdest thing about Elvis. Elvis always talked about doing these things that Parker wouldnt let him do, and repeatedly would say he hated him and was going to fire him, but for some reason he never did. I think the reason for Elvis staying with the Colonel was the fact that Elvis was a very loyal person, especially to those that had been with him since the beginning. And I think Elvis needed and wanted someone there to guide and tell him what to do, and we all know he needed someone to always motivate him.

[Menwithbrokenhearts]

Earl Greenwood is in no way related to Elvis Presley. He never lived in Tupeol MS and never worked for Elvis. What he did do was read other books and then taking from them constructed his one. No one in the Elvis world takes him seriously or believes his book. He's not related! A bogus!

His claim to fame is he hung around the Graceland gates in the 50's and was allowed to go to some parties.Some of his "made up" stories border on the absolutely laughable. Like the Tupelo Tornado story. Or the double dates with Elvis and Dixie Locke.

I believe it knocked Gail Brewer Girogios book off the No.1 spot for Elvis books in

he fiction category.

Thanks for setting me straight on that! I felt it was a bit contrived when i read it. It is so hard to seperate all these publications and sort through what is good and what is crap. I'm reading the two Peter Guralnick books right now and enjoy them alot so far. For once it feels as though I'm reading a truly authentic and professional biography, that seems much more objective. What are your thoughts on these books. Thanks again!!!

[0349054]

Hey,

No sweat. The Guarnlick books are a good read, the first is much better than the second - as in the second, he rushed it out and also had taken a payment from EPE to do a book after "Careless Love", so in my opinion and from reading the books and speaking with people who were around Elvis at the time, he has put a very pro-EPE slant on things and is liberal with his interpretation of the truth in parts.

Apart from that, you should read the Alanna Nash books, and also as many books from the guys who were around Elvis - I prefer first hand accounts of his life, as opposed to an authors interpretation. Then, generally after reading all them you come to your own conclusion on what happened, where, how and why.(y)

[Menwithbrokenhearts]

Hey,

No sweat. The Guarnlick books are a good read, the first is much better than the second - as in the second, he rushed it out and also had taken a payment from EPE to do a book after "Careless Love", so in my opinion and from reading the books and speaking with people who were around Elvis at the time, he has put a very pro-EPE slant on things and is liberal with his interpretation of the truth in parts.

Apart from that, you should read the Alanna Nash books, and also as many books from the guys who were around Elvis - I prefer first hand accounts of his life, as opposed to an authors interpretation. Then, generally after reading all them you come to your own conclusion on what happened, where, how and why.(y)

thanks so much for the advice. I will get to those books also. Oh, by the way, I really enjoy your posts here. You almost seem as though you have an inside track on Elvis. I hope you don't get too frustrated with us newbees (with the same questions over and over) but it is a great format to get things off your mind and straight on all things Elvis. Thanks!

[0349054]

thanks so much for the advice. I will get to those books also. Oh, by the way, I really enjoy your posts here. You almost seem as though you have an inside track on Elvis. I hope you don't get too frustrated with us newbees (with the same questions over and over) but it is a great format to get things off your mind and straight on all things Elvis. Thanks!

Not at all, your welcome and thanks for the kind words. I really enjoy it here. As has been said by man before; "Elvis" is our drug of choice.

[KPM]

Theres an old saying trust half of what you see and nothing that you hear(read) because humans are flawed(including your own perception at times)