Was Elvis really offered these movies?

[Brian]

I know Elvis was actually offered 2 films Thunder Road and A Star is Born that he did not appear in

For many years it has been rumored that Elvis was offered roles in these movies

The Defiant Ones, Midnight Cowboy, West Side Story and Sweet Bird of youth


I will go on record as saying I don't think Elvis was offered any of them but does anybody know for sure?

[Tony Trout]

Brian,

Was Elvis offered the roles you mention? Yes, he was. Here are the supposed reasons behind why he didn't get them (courtesy of the wonderful - but outdated - book "Elvis - His Life From A To Z" on pages 316-317:

Sweet Bird Of Youth: Elvis was offered the lead role of Chance Wayne in 'Sweet Bird Of Youth' which was based on the Tennessee Williams play.
But because Elvis would have been playing a "bad guy," Colonel Parker
turned down the offer, allowing Paul Newman to win the part. Ed Begley won an Oscar for Best Supporting Actor for his performance as Boss Finley.

The Defiant Ones: Reportedly, Elvis was first offered the role of John (Joker) Jackson in this Stanley Kramer-directed film. Tony Curtis, one of Elvis's favorite actors, was later given the role. The Defiant Ones, which won an Oscar for Best Screenplay, was the last screen appearance of Our Gang's Carl (Alfalfa) Switzer.

Midnight Cowboy: Midnight Cowboy is the only X-rated movie to win an Oscar for Best Picture. The rating, however, was later reduced to R. The role of Joe Buck, played by John Voight, was first offered to Elvis. One can only imagine how Elvis's fans would have reacted to him playing a seedy character in an X-rated film. Bob Dylan originally composed "Lay Lady Lay" for Midnight Cowboy, but Harry Nilsson's "Everybody's Talking" was chosen instead.

West Side Story: United Artists and producer Robert Wise reportedly wanted Elvis, Paul Anka, Favian, Bobby Darin, and Frankie Avalon to play members of the two gangs the Jets and the Sharks in West Side Story. One can only imagine what a lead role in the Best Picture of 1961 would have done for Elvis's acting career!

[Brian]

Brian,

Was Elvis offered the roles you mention? Yes, he was. Here are the supposed reasons behind why he didn't get them (courtesy of the wonderful - but outdated - book "Elvis - His Life From A To Z" on pages 316-317:

Sweet Bird Of Youth: Elvis was offered the lead role of Chance Wayne in 'Sweet Bird Of Youth' which was based on the Tennessee Williams play.
But because Elvis would have been playing a "bad guy," Colonel Parker
turned down the offer, allowing Paul Newman to win the part. Ed Begley won an Oscar for Best Supporting Actor for his performance as Boss Finley.

The Defiant Ones: Reportedly, Elvis was first offered the role of John (Joker) Jackson in this Stanley Kramer-directed film. Tony Curtis, one of Elvis's favorite actors, was later given the role. The Defiant Ones, which won an Oscar for Best Screenplay, was the last screen appearance of Our Gang's Carl (Alfalfa) Switzer.

Midnight Cowboy: Midnight Cowboy is the only X-rated movie to win an Oscar for Best Picture. The rating, however, was later reduced to R. The role of Joe Buck, played by John Voight, was first offered to Elvis. One can only imagine how Elvis's fans would have reacted to him playing a seedy character in an X-rated film. Bob Dylan originally composed "Lay Lady Lay" for Midnight Cowboy, but Harry Nilsson's "Everybody's Talking" was chosen instead.

West Side Story: United Artists and producer Robert Wise reportedly wanted Elvis, Paul Anka, Favian, Bobby Darin, and Frankie Avalon to play members of the two gangs the Jets and the Sharks in West Side Story. One can only imagine what a lead role in the Best Picture of 1961 would have done for Elvis's acting career!


I have heard that before but I don't think he was offered Sweet Bird of Youth
Paul Newman played the role on Broadway and was a big box office draw at the time

As for the Defiant Ones it came around the time Elvis was drafted
Elvis had to have a deferment just to make King Creole and the story goes that Elvis was offered the role after the producers saw his performance in King Creole.

As for West Side Story I've never heard anyone connected with the movie actually say whether or not Elvis was offered the part. I think he may have been considered for the role because of his singing abilities but ultimately passed over and never actually offered the role. or maybe this is another gigatic myth in the Elvis world. Even if Elvis had been offered the role and appeared in the film I don't know how much it would have done for his reputation as an actor as it's a musical.

Midnight Cowboy came out in a time when Elvis was just getting out of his contract to make movies and by then he lost most his credibility as an aspiring serious actor. I've actually heard that the script had been around for a few years and one of the studio's suggested that if the script had been cleaned up some it could make a good vehicle for Elvis with songs included.
I don't really believe Elvis was offered the part besides by 1969 he was probably too old to play the young and naive Joe Buck.

[laura17]

he was offered all those roles.plus the sundance kid.tim burton has said his first choice as batman,would have been elvis,not michael keaton.

[Tony Trout]

I have heard that before but I don't think he was offered Sweet Bird of Youth
Paul Newman played the role on Broadway and was a big box office draw at the time

As for the Defiant Ones it came around the time Elvis was drafted
Elvis had to have a deferment just to make King Creole and the story goes that Elvis was offered the role after the producers saw his performance in King Creole.

As for West Side Story I've never heard anyone connected with the movie actually say whether or not Elvis was offered the part. I think he may have been considered for the role because of his singing abilities but ultimately passed over and never actually offered the role. or maybe this is another gigatic myth in the Elvis world. Even if Elvis had been offered the role and appeared in the film I don't know how much it would have done for his reputation as an actor as it's a musical.

Midnight Cowboy came out in a time when Elvis was just getting out of his contract to make movies and by then he lost most his credibility as an aspiring serious actor. I've actually heard that the script had been around for a few years and one of the studio's suggested that if the script had been cleaned up some it could make a good vehicle for Elvis with songs included.
I don't really believe Elvis was offered the part besides by 1969 he was probably too old to play the young and naive Joe Buck.



Brian,

If he hadn't been offered these roles there wouldn't have been any mention of them. He was, in fact, offered the roles in the movies I listed but (for whatever reasons Col. Parker came up with) he turned them down.

[javierTCB]

Interesting thread(y)

[Brian]

Brian,

If he hadn't been offered these roles there wouldn't have been any mention of them. He was, in fact, offered the roles in the movies I listed but (for whatever reasons Col. Parker came up with) he turned them down.


there is such a thing as rumors

That's what I'm saying I believe that Elvis A-z is wrong and that he was never offered any of the roles listed

I'm trying to get to the bottom of which hollywood roles Elvis was offered and which ones are just untrue.

over the years their has been some fans that have criticized A-z as being full of errors.

what is A-z source for these movie roles being offered to Elvis.

[KPM]

there is such a thing as rumors

That's what I'm saying I believe that Elvis A-z is wrong and that he was never offered any of the roles listed

I'm trying to get to the bottom of which hollywood roles Elvis was offered and which ones are just untrue.

over the years their has been some fans that have criticized A-z as being full of errors.

what is A-z source for these movie roles being offered to Elvis.
IMO There is no way to truely get to the bottom some of this-the roles could have been offered verbally in one single conversation between a studio, a producer, a director etc....and the Col.-he turned them down during that conversation so end of story. I think some of the offers were "wish lists" by producers or directors when speaking of who they might want in some of these roles and then any "feelers" put out to Parker were perhaps ignored its hard to say.
IMO You would have to speak to every producer, director, studio head, casting agent who ever worked on a film to know with any degree of accuracy about all the films Elvis may have been asked about or wanted for.
Some were pretty well known and talked about so we have the list you posted, as I said others may have been single conversations and that was the end of it.
I'll give you another role that Elvis was wanted for (and until recently I had never heard about) and did not work out.
The male lead in the movie "All the Fine Young Cannibals" 1960
Robert Wagner in his recent autobiography(which I just read) says that he was told by the studio-Elvis and Liz Taylor were the first choices for the leads in this movie, and when that fell through he and wife Natalie Wood got the parts. I had never heard that before-until Wagner mentioned it in his book. Wagner also says he was offered a role in "Flaming Star" and he turned it down because he knew all eyes were on Elvis in an Elvis movie.

[utmom2008]

I know Elvis was actually offered 2 films Thunder Road and A Star is Born that he did not appear in
For many years it has been rumored that Elvis was offered roles in these movies
The Defiant Ones, Midnight Cowboy, West Side Story and Sweet Bird of youth
I will go on record as saying I don't think Elvis was offered any of them but does anybody know for sure?


Brian,
Was Elvis offered the roles you mention? Yes, he was. Here are the supposed reasons behind why he didn't get them (courtesy of the wonderful - but outdated - book "Elvis - His Life From A To Z" on pages 316-317:



I have heard that before but I don't think he was offered Sweet Bird of Youth.

As for West Side Story I've never heard anyone connected with the movie actually say whether or not Elvis was offered the part. I think he may have been considered for the role because of his singing abilities but ultimately passed over and never actually offered the role.


I don't really believe Elvis was offered the part besides by 1969 he was probably too old to play the young and naive Joe Buck.

Absolutely amazing!:blink::blink: You ask for answers, TonyT gives you the answers....and then you disagree.:supriced::lol:If I didn't know better I would swear that you just set up Tony for argument's sake.;);)

[laura17]

i just met robert wagner

[TotallyInsane]

i just met robert wagner


Did he drop by for coffee??? Give us details.... :D

[Brian]

[/b][/u]



[/b][/u]

Absolutely amazing!:blink::blink: You ask for answers, TonyT gives you the answers....and then you disagree.:supriced::lol:If I didn't know better I would swear that you just set up Tony for argument's sake.;);)


no

I wanted to know the source

where Elvis A-z got that info from

like I said Elvis A-z is known for errors


I have nothing against Tony

[Brian]

IMO There is no way to truely get to the bottom some of this-the roles could have been offered verbally in one single conversation between a studio, a producer, a director etc....and the Col.-he turned them down during that conversation so end of story. I think some of the offers were "wish lists" by producers or directors when speaking of who they might want in some of these roles and then any "feelers" put out to Parker were perhaps ignored its hard to say.
IMO You would have to speak to every producer, director, studio head, casting agent who ever worked on a film to know with any degree of accuracy about all the films Elvis may have been asked about or wanted for.
Some were pretty well known and talked about so we have the list you posted, as I said others may have been single conversations and that was the end of it.
I'll give you another role that Elvis was wanted for (and until recently I had never heard about) and did not work out.
The male lead in the movie "All the Fine Young Cannibals" 1960
Robert Wagner in his recent autobiography(which I just read) says that he was told by the studio-Elvis and Liz Taylor were the first choices for the leads in this movie, and when that fell through he and wife Natalie Wood got the parts. I had never heard that before-until Wagner mentioned it in his book. Wagner also says he was offered a role in "Flaming Star" and he turned it down because he knew all eyes were on Elvis in an Elvis movie.

that would have been a bad idea imo

Elvis and Liz Taylor lol

[laura17]

no he was at a book signing..i live in palm springs.. he was very nice.

[KPM]

that would have been a bad idea imo

Elvis and Liz Taylor lol
I do not see the potential pairing as funny-they were both young, great looking and very hot entertainment figures in 1960. When Elvis had good actors in his films his own acting was better IMO.
Obviously someone at the studio or the producer saw a potential for these two in this film-or they would have not been the first choices for the leads.
I think this is overlooked or discounted when people speak of roles Elvis was offered or considered for-that many talented people wanted him for serious films because they saw raw talent and potential to be better.
All the fine Young Cannibals as it ended up was not a great film, which Wagners acknowledges in his book.
The movie would not have been the same film with different leads so who knows how it would have turned out.
I'm pretty sure it would have done much better box office with Elvis and Elizabeth in the leads-just by their name values alone.

[Tony Trout]

[/b][/u]



[/b][/u]

Absolutely amazing!:blink::blink: You ask for answers, TonyT gives you the answers....and then you disagree.:supriced::lol:If I didn't know better I would swear that you just set up Tony for argument's sake.;);)


no

I wanted to know the source

where Elvis A-z got that info from

like I said Elvis A-z is known for errors


I have nothing against Tony



"Elvis - His Life From A To Z" does have errors but I do believe that (had it not been true about Elvis being offered these roles) they wouldn't have had that particular section in the book itself.

(And....thank you, Rosanne. :) )

[KPM]

no

I wanted to know the source

where Elvis A-z got that info from

like I said Elvis A-z is known for errors


I have nothing against Tony
Tony produced a source-if you want to know where that source got the info-contact the authors- it is your question not Tonys.
As far as books having errors-thats par for the course- but that does not make every point in those books untrue or somehow taint its contents.
Sometimes Brian you may not find the sources-as I said we can not go back and find what may have been talked about in a single conversation between 2 peopl (which leaked into the press)-or in the board room at MGM, Paramount, Warner Brothers etc.... as cast discussions are
being made amonst studio heads, directors and producers.
Most of these people are dead, and the chances of the ones alive remembering the names considered for all the movies they were involved in is pretty slim. But this type stuff leaked all the time to the press-many times purposely trying to get interest from the party wanted (or sometimes it was leaked that a certain actor wanted a role to try and spur talks from the other side)
But most of these roles which have been discussed since the late 60s must have an ignition point of origin-but its like trying to figure out how a fire started 20-30 years ago.

[EPguide]

Robert Mitchum asked Elvis to play a part in Thunder Road.

Mitchum's son in a fairly recent biography said how cool it was to tell people Elvis was at his home for dinner. :xmas:

Not Christmas dinner. :)

[KPM]

I have heard that before but I don't think he was offered Sweet Bird of Youth
Paul Newman played the role on Broadway and was a big box office draw at the time

As for the Defiant Ones it came around the time Elvis was drafted
Elvis had to have a deferment just to make King Creole and the story goes that Elvis was offered the role after the producers saw his performance in King Creole.

As for West Side Story I've never heard anyone connected with the movie actually say whether or not Elvis was offered the part. I think he may have been considered for the role because of his singing abilities but ultimately passed over and never actually offered the role. or maybe this is another gigatic myth in the Elvis world. Even if Elvis had been offered the role and appeared in the film I don't know how much it would have done for his reputation as an actor as it's a musical.

Midnight Cowboy came out in a time when Elvis was just getting out of his contract to make movies and by then he lost most his credibility as an aspiring serious actor. I've actually heard that the script had been around for a few years and one of the studio's suggested that if the script had been cleaned up some it could make a good vehicle for Elvis with songs included.
I don't really believe Elvis was offered the part besides by 1969 he was probably too old to play the young and naive Joe Buck.
The director of WSS, Robert Wise, wanted Elvis for the roll of Tony I have heard Rita Moreno say this in an interview years ago on Merv Griffith daytime TV talk show. IMBD also mentions this in its Trivia section for the film.

[Diane]

Between Tony and KPM who have bent over backwards for you...and the books, you have all the answers you're ever going to be able to get so be grateful and gracefully accept what you've been given instead of arguing with them.

Diane

[Tony Trout]

Robert Mitchum asked Elvis to play a part in Thunder Road.

Mitchum's son in a fairly recent biography said how cool it was to tell people Elvis was at his home for dinner. :xmas:

Not Christmas dinner. :)



According to Lamar Fike in "Revelations From The Memphis Mafia" on page 92, Robert Mitchum approached Elvis somewhere at the studio while Elvis was filming "Jailhouse Rock" - not at Mitchum's house.

[utmom2008]

(And....thank you, Rosanne. :) )
You are welcome SP!:notworthy


Between Tony and KPM who have bent over backwards for you...and the books, you have all the answers you're ever going to be able to get so be grateful and gracefully accept what you've been given instead of arguing with them.

Diane

Well said Diane.:notworthy(y)(y)(y)

[Brian]

The director of WSS, Robert Wise, wanted Elvis for the roll of Tony I have heard Rita Moreno say this in an interview years ago on Merv Griffith daytime TV talk show. IMBD also mentions this in its Trivia section for the film.


thank you Ken

Robert Wise is the best source for this

I read that Elvis was offered the part on imdb but I have also noticed that they have errors on that site.

[EPguide]

According to Lamar Fike in "Revelations From The Memphis Mafia" on page 92, Robert Mitchum approached Elvis somewhere at the studio while Elvis was filming "Jailhouse Rock" - not at Mitchum's house.

I didn't say he asked at the house. The story was out well before Lamar Fikes book anyway.

The Mitchum biography was a different story published decades later. That's why I seperated the sentences.

If I remember correctly (It's about 50 years since I saw the movie at the cinema) Jim Mitchum played the part Robert Mitchum intended for Elvis.

http://www.metropulse.com/news/2008/jun/18/blazing-right-through-knoxville/

[Brian]

"Elvis - His Life From A To Z" does have errors but I do believe that (had it not been true about Elvis being offered these roles) they wouldn't have had that particular section in the book itself.

(And....thank you, Rosanne. :) )


Thank you, Tony
for all your help

I think Elvis A-Z may have just written down which movie roles it's been rumored that Elvis had been offered.

[Brian]

I do not see the potential pairing as funny-they were both young, great looking and very hot entertainment figures in 1960. When Elvis had good actors in his films his own acting was better IMO.
Obviously someone at the studio or the producer saw a potential for these two in this film-or they would have not been the first choices for the leads.
I think this is overlooked or discounted when people speak of roles Elvis was offered or considered for-that many talented people wanted him for serious films because they saw raw talent and potential to be better.
All the fine Young Cannibals as it ended up was not a great film, which Wagners acknowledges in his book.
The movie would not have been the same film with different leads so who knows how it would have turned out.
I'm pretty sure it would have done much better box office with Elvis and Elizabeth in the leads-just by their name values alone.


I don't see Elvis and Taylor on screen together

I think she was a better actress and would have blown him off the screen and I also don't see them as an on screen couple.

[utmom2008]

he was offered all those roles.plus the sundance kid.

I have never heard of that role being offered to Elvis, however it is widely known that the role of The Sundance Kid was first offered to Warren Beatty.:blink::blink:

[KPM]

I don't see Elvis and Taylor on screen together

I think she was a better actress and would have blown him off the screen and I also don't see them as an on screen couple.
Some people like caviar and some hate it-some like white wine, others red its all in your own personal taste.
You sir have your subjective opinions and others have theirs.
I have said several times I feel Elvis had a natural acting talent-and I have said before many producers, directors, and other actors felt he could act.
(I have also named some who have given him praise- several times on other threads and will not do so again) I tend to give a little more creedance to people who know what it takes to make a good movie or performance. Just as I give more creedance to a mechanic on car performance, or a electrician for electrical questions etc.........
IMO The better the script, production values, director and cast-the better he was in his roles.
Its like his live performances its often been said he "fed off the audience" and I think in his acting career he fed off the actors and production around him. You do not agree (I am assuming)-but thats my feeling.
The fact is many in Hollywood -saw his talent and potential.

[Brian]

Some people like caviar and some hate it-some like white wine, others red its all in your own personal taste.
You sir have your subjective opinions and others have theirs.
I have said several times I feel Elvis had a natural acting talent-and I have said before many producers, directors, and other actors felt he could act.
(I have also named some who have given him praise- several times on other threads and will not do so again) I tend to give a little more creedance to people who know what it takes to make a good movie or performance. Just as I give more creedance to a mechanic on car performance, or a electrician for electrical questions etc.........
IMO The better the script, production values, director and cast-the better he was in his roles.
Its like his live performances its often been said he "fed off the audience" and I think in his acting career he fed off the actors and production around him. You do not agree (I am assuming)-but thats my feeling.
The fact is many in Hollywood -saw his talent and potential.


I think for Elvis to have been a better actor he would've had to take lessons.
until then he was always going to be a limited actor.

[Getlo]

When all is said and done, most of these are simply rumours. There is a difference between someone wanting Elvis for a part and actually making an offer.

The only actual, formal offer was A Star Is Born, which as you know came directly from Barbra Streisand and her husband Jon Peters in 1975.

As for The Rainmaker, he screen tested a couple of scenes from this proposed film on April 26, 1956 with actor Frank Faylen; the footage is lost, only still pictures remain.

He mentioned that he was going to do this movie in an interview from 1956, but I think he misunderstood the process. The screen test was just that: a test, to see how he came up on screen. There is nothing to suggest he was offered a part. Love Me Tender was later created for him.

Remember: HUGE difference between choice, wish and formal offer.


If he hadn't been offered these roles there wouldn't have been any mention of them.

TT, come on. You know how rumours start in the Elvis world!

Elvis A-Z is hopelessly outdated now, and much of the content can be dismissed. There's a lot of "reportedly" in there, with nothing to back it up.


Robert Mitchum asked Elvis to play a part in Thunder Road.

Which may have been true. But this is not a formal offer.

[rickb]

it is an amazing case of bad management when you consider how many good roles Elvis didn't get while he forced to endure rubbish like Clambake, PHS etc

[Brian]

it is an amazing case of bad management when you consider how many good roles Elvis didn't get while he forced to endure rubbish like Clambake, PHS etc


that's the way hollywood was back then

the studio's picked what movies Elvis would make and he didn't have any say so in the matter as that was also the case with other actors of that time.

[EPguide]

When all is said and done, most of these are simply rumours. There is a difference between someone wanting Elvis for a part and actually making an offer.

The only actual, formal offer was A Star Is Born, which as you know came directly from Barbra Streisand and her husband Jon Peters in 1975.

As for The Rainmaker, he screen tested a couple of scenes from this proposed film on April 26, 1956 with actor Frank Faylen; the footage is lost, only still pictures remain.

He mentioned that he was going to do this movie in an interview from 1956, but I think he misunderstood the process. The screen test was just that: a test, to see how he came up on screen. There is nothing to suggest he was offered a part. Love Me Tender was later created for him.

Remember: HUGE difference between choice, wish and formal offer.



TT, come on. You know how rumours start in the Elvis world!

Elvis A-Z is hopelessly outdated now, and much of the content can be dismissed. There's a lot of "reportedly" in there, with nothing to back it up.



Which may have been true. But this is not a formal offer.

I did not say it was a formal offer.

If Elvis and his manager had been more open to the idea at the time, it may have lead to a formal offer.

It all belongs in the "Coulda, woulda, shoulda" department, Judge Judy is so fond of.

As for Elvis's acting ability it was promising in those early movies, and not under such a severe microscope as we have today.
James Drury (The Virginian) thought Elvis was quite believable in "Love Me Tender". He said so quite recently. I have a Radio interview with him on CD.

Many fine actors ended up making movies that were absolutely slammed by movie critics.

I remember Robert Mitchum replying to an obsequious journalist who had asked him how he had studied for a certain role he had played years ago, and did he think he had projected the role of the movie character accurately.

Mitchum replied, "I have not even seen the movie". :lmfao:

Audiences of the day really enjoyed Elvis's early, and best movies.

[cbg84]

I don't know about all the other moveis but I've heard more than once that Robert Wise wanted Elvis to play Tony in West Side Story. But then again I don't know if Elvis was offered the roll or if he was just concidered.

[KPM]

I think for Elvis to have been a better actor he would've had to take lessons.
until then he was always going to be a limited actor.
Totally disagree-People do not learn a craft of any kind in the same way-thats just a fact.
Some get taught and that is best for them, others learn by doing and working at it-I think Elvis was one of those type people.
Many actors never have a lesson and become great actors- Humphrey Bogart never had a lesson, neither did Dustin Hoffman-who began in theater at the Pasadena Playhouse and just worked at it etc....
John Wayne is an example of someone who was a horrid actor in his first years and then as he "worked at the craft" became a very good actor-good enough to win an Oscar and be nominated for another. His work in "The Searchers" continues to be widely regarded as perhaps Wayne's finest and most complex performance. In 2006 Premiere Magazine ran an industry poll in which Wayne's portrayal of Ethan Edwards was rated the 87th greatest performance in film history.
[

[Brian]

Totally disagree-People do not learn a craft of any kind in the same way-thats just a fact.
Some get taught and that is best for them, others learn by doing and working at it-I think Elvis was one of those type people.
Many actors never have a lesson and become great actors- Humphrey Bogart never had a lesson, neither did Dustin Hoffman-who began in theater at the Pasadena Playhouse and just worked at it etc....
John Wayne is an example of someone who was a horrid actor in his first years and then as he "worked at the craft" became a very good actor-good enough to win an Oscar and be nominated for another. His work in "The Searchers" continues to be widely regarded as perhaps Wayne's finest and most complex performance. In 2006 Premiere Magazine ran an industry poll in which Wayne's portrayal of Ethan Edwards was rated the 87th greatest performance in film history.


[

most actors do take lessons

I doesn't matter what those actors you mentioned did because Elvis was different.

I'm saying Elvis needed acting lessons

p.s. I thought John Wayne was good in some of his roles like Red River and the one you mentioned The Searchers but I think he could have benefited from taking lessons and been a better actor for it.

[MissyM]

I agree with KPM, I watch a lot of old movies. Many of the acots/actresses were not that great. And John Wayne was type cast so much that no matter what movie of him you watched, it was the some old scenes in a way. I love Wayne, but come on versatile is not a word I'd use to discribe his acting abilities. When Paul Newman first started it was the same, but her very much grew and could do about any part. RIP Paul!
Richard Whitmark the same, the characters very much the same, not that they weren't good at those charactors. What about Bob Hope and Bing Crosby and all those movies that were funny but still the same. Bing grew and did more dramatic movies.
But for the movies Elvis did, as green as he was, I think he was as good as many actors who were the same age. I see no reason why with good direction he couldn't have expanded, been versatile and become an excellent actor. I sure could see him doing West Side Story.
One thing I love about Elvis's acting is that he seemed to really become the person he was portraying. That makes for a very good actor eventually.

[Brian]

I agree with KPM, I watch a lot of old movies. Many of the acots/actresses were not that great. And John Wayne was type cast so much that no matter what movie of him you watched, it was the some old scenes in a way. I love Wayne, but come on versatile is not a word I'd use to discribe his acting abilities. When Paul Newman first started it was the same, but her very much grew and could do about any part. RIP Paul!
Richard Whitmark the same, the characters very much the same, not that they weren't good at those charactors. What about Bob Hope and Bing Crosby and all those movies that were funny but still the same. Bing grew and did more dramatic movies.
But for the movies Elvis did, as green as he was, I think he was as good as many actors who were the same age. I see no reason why with good direction he couldn't have expanded, been versatile and become an excellent actor. I sure could see him doing West Side Story.
One thing I love about Elvis's acting is that he seemed to really become the person he was portraying. That makes for a very good actor eventually.


Richard Widmark and Paul Newman both took acting lessons though

I think Elvis became the character he was playing because he played himself mostly

[Brian]

Totally disagree-People do not learn a craft of any kind in the same way-thats just a fact.
Some get taught and that is best for them, others learn by doing and working at it-I think Elvis was one of those type people.
Many actors never have a lesson and become great actors- Humphrey Bogart never had a lesson, neither did Dustin Hoffman-who began in theater at the Pasadena Playhouse and just worked at it etc....

[


Bogart never took lessons but Hoffman did

he studied acting while he was in college and then studied acting at the Los Angeles consevatory of music and he also received some training at the Pasadena Playhouse.

[KPM]

most actors do take lessons

I doesn't matter what those actors you mentioned did because Elvis was different.
I'm saying Elvis needed acting lessons

p.s. I thought John Wayne was good in some of his roles like Red River and the one you mentioned The Searchers but I think he could have benefited from taking lessons and been a better actor for it.
Why? Was Elvis different from any other human who gets involved in any profession? He was human, and humans learn in different fashions- as I said some learn easily by being taught I agree with you on that, but others learn by doing I think Elvis was that type individual. My son was brain damaged at birth-he did not learn like my daughters-his reading ability never went beyond the 2nd grade level but we found ways to teach him at home and school so he learned to do almost anything my daughters could.
No one taught Elvis how to sing, nor make music-he had no lessons but he learned by listening, and then doing it. That is a prime example of how Elvis learned.
You can say Elvis needed acting lessons but that does not make it necessarily so-it is an opinion which you have formed.
Others do not agree with your assessment. Sometimes lessons for people with natural abilities -detracts from that natural ability- and actually does more harm than good. We will never agree on this point-you have an opinion and so do I.

[KPM]

]Richard Widmark and Paul Newman both took acting lessons though[/B]I think Elvis became the character he was playing because he played himself mostly
Yes many actors do take lessons-and many do not.
Acting lessons was the choice of Widmark and Paul Newman because they felt it was what they needed to improve their craft. But I can tell you they would never say "All people who want to act need lessons"
All people are different-and each does things best in the fashion which they are comfortable with.

[Brian]

Yes many actors do take lessons-and many do not.
Acting lessons was the choice of Widmark and Paul Newman because they felt it was what they needed to improve their craft. But I can tell you they would never say "All people who want to act need lessons"


I don't know about Newman or Widmark saying it but I've heard many actors give advice to aspiring actors where they say it's best to take lessons.

Red West who became an actor says Elvis needed lessons

[KPM]

Bogart never took lessons but Hoffman did

he studied acting while he was in college and then studied acting at the Los Angeles consevatory of music and he also received some training at the Pasadena Playhouse.
He took an acting course not to learn according IMBD-but because he was told "No one flunks this course" and he was flunking most of his other courses. I was unaware of the LA Conservator of Music.
If you would like my friend, I will do a search "of all the actors who never took a lesson" and I will get out some of my biography collection and look up some. Is that really necessary? Jack Nicholson was a horrid actor in the eary days-When Jack Nicholson first came to Hollywood, he worked as a go-fer for animation legends Hanna-Barbera. Seeing his talent as an artist, they offered Nicholson a starting level position as an animation artist. However, citing his desire to become an actor, he turned them down
He made his film debut in a low-budget teen drama The Cry Baby Killer, in 1958, playing the title role.For the following decade,Nicholson was a frequent collaborator with the film's producer, Roger Corman. He learned film by doing b-movies with Corman and others. He has 3 Oscars and 12 nominations.
The point is -many actors- do not take- lessons. I can acknowledge others do take lessons-but not all actors do-or need to.
Many just start in pictures or fall into roles and learn as they go.

[KPM]

I don't know about Newman or Widmark saying it but I've heard many actors give advice to aspiring actors where they say it's best to take lessons.

Red West who became an actor says Elvis needed lessons
I do not pigeon hole people-I do not make blanket statements about the human race on any subject. Each person is unique and I can not make it any clearer than that.
Red West is giving an opinion, so am I, so are you.
I will also add that this has gotten off the subject in the thread you started-about roles that may or may not have been offered to Elvis.

[EPguide]

I don't know about Newman or Widmark saying it but I've heard many actors give advice to aspiring actors where they say it's best to take lessons.

Red West who became an actor says Elvis needed lessons


Back in 1970 I knew a guy was studying acting. My wife and i went to see him play Macbeth at a University theatre. Other roles too. He moved away from the city where we lived and we lost contact with him. He eventually got parts in TV Dramas. Then a in famous series, "The Black Stuff". He was nominated for "Actor of the Year" in the early 1970s. Lost to a very famous actor.

He then appeared in the Movies "Ghandi", and "Titanic", and we last seen him alongside Clint Eastwood in a Hollywood thriller.

Bernard Hill studied his craft for decades. These days he is a regular narrator on TV Travelogues.

Bernard married and divorced our daughter's piano teacher circa 1971.

He and I played chess in our home back then.

Some would say Bernard was a highly successful actor.
But compared to to Elvis ........?
Try and be objective now. :)

[Brian]

Back in 1970 I knew a guy was studying acting. My wife and i went to see him play Macbeth at a University theatre. Other roles too. He moved away from the city where we lived and we lost contact with him. He eventually got parts in TV Dramas. Then a in famous series, "The Black Stuff". He was nominated for "Actor of the Year" in the early 1970s. Lost to a very famous actor.

He then appeared in the Movies "Ghandi", and "Titanic", and we last seen him alongside Clint Eastwood in a Hollywood thriller.

Bernard Hill studied his craft for decades. These days he is a regular narrator on TV Travelogues.

Bernard married and divorced our daughter's piano teacher circa 1971.

He and I played chess in our home back then.

Some would say Bernard was a highly successful actor.
But compared to to Elvis ........?
Try and be objective now. :)


I'm not talking about or comparing popularity

I'm talking about the quality of acting.

Elvis got more roles than Bernard because he was a popular singer but I bet Bernard is a better actor than Elvis.

[Brian]

I do not pigeon hole people-I do not make blanket statements about the human race on any subject. Each person is unique and I can not make it any clearer than that.
Red West is giving an opinion, so am I, so are you.
I will also add that this has gotten off the subject in the thread you started-about roles that may or may not have been offered to Elvis.


it's all on topic

What I'm basically saying is

Elvis did have some natural acting talent but to take his acting to the next level he would've had to have some training. The many actors that were better than him were mainly better because they studied acting.

If it's true that Elvis was offered the roles mentioned I don't think he would have been as good as the actors that got those roles because he didn't study acting and didn't have as much experience as they did.

In order for Elvis to have been seen as a good actor he would've had to study acting and work hard at his craft then get some better roles.

I think he would need both of those things to be successful.

I used Red West as an example because he has been a successful character actor, he also teaches acting and of course he was a friend to Elvis.
he's of the opinion Elvis needed training.

From what I've heard Elvis ultimate goal was to be a great actor like Marlon Brando and since Brando took lessons and Elvis wanted to be as good as him he should've took lessons.
In the long run I think he would've improved as an actor if he had.

[KPM]

it's all on topic

What I'm basically saying is

Elvis did have some natural acting talent but to take his acting to the next level he would've had to have some training. The many actors that were better than him were mainly better because they studied acting.

If it's true that Elvis was offered the roles mentioned I don't think he would have been as good as the actors that got those roles because he didn't study acting and didn't have as much experience as they did.

In order for Elvis to have been seen as a good actor he would've had to study acting and work hard at his craft then get some better roles.I think he would need both of those things to be successful.

I used Red West as an example because he has been a successful character actor, he also teaches acting and of course he was a friend to Elvis.
he's of the opinion Elvis needed training.

From what I've heard Elvis ultimate goal was to be a great actor like Marlon Brando and since Brando took lessons and Elvis wanted to be as good as him he should've took lessons.
In the long run I think he would've improved as an actor if he had.
Sorry I just do not agree so I am finished with this thread. I have pointed out how Elvis seemed to learn music by doing and experimenting-no music teacher came in and taught him note for note how to read music to sing or play. He was a C student in school-he learned by doing and working. Good directors, good scripts, good producers help anyone who acts find their best work. (otherwise why have a director) I do not feel Elvis (or anyone for that matter) has to have acting lessons to get better. Perhaps it would have helped-but also perhaps it would have hurt. You have a perfect right to your opinion-and I have a right to mine etc....you see it as you see it-that does not make it set in concrete correct-and the same with my opinion.
I understand what you are saying-and just do not see it that way. I think there is no way to know how Elvis would have done in any role he was offered (or suppose to have been offered) because I do not limit what he could have done with the right director, right script-right situation. You seem to have a pretty tight lock on the idea he could not expand without teaching-we disagree.

[EPguide]

I'm not talking about or comparing popularity

I'm talking about the quality of acting.

Elvis got more roles than Bernard because he was a popular singer but I bet Bernard is a better actor than Elvis.

Sorry Brian, I do not agree with your appraisal at all.

Elvis Presley showed far more emotion in his roles than Bernard Hill ever did. Elvis's characters on screen were often riveting.

Sadly the not so good Elvis movies have tended to eclipse the better ones as seen through the eyes of blinkered critics.

I have no doubt Elvis's best acting in quite a number of movies, will be acknowledged by far fairer and more honest movie critics in the near future.

[hounddog]

I agree EP guide, there's been to much focus on his bad movies not enough credit for his good one. I posted this article here a while ago and i wanted to share it again in this forum http://www.tcb-world.com/showthread.php?t=23836.

[hounddog]

"From what I've heard Elvis ultimate goal was to be a great actor like Marlon Brando and since Brando took lessons and Elvis wanted to be as good as him he should've took lessons."

Ok in answer to this. I don't agree. I have a degree in Theatre Theory and Practice so i feel able to talk about this topic with knowledge. Part of that course included acting lessons. During that time I saw a lot of the Acting degree students get so caught up in the theory of acting that they lost the their emotional reaction to a role and they freeely admitted to this, that the theroy was causing them issues with playing their roles. They were trying to hard to reach the method concept of the part. To caught in the teaching of acting and not finding the heart of the role.

Yes acting lessons can give you ideas on how to look for the character of the role. But i can also hinder if that is all you look for and you lose the characters reactions to situations. The actor has to put him self in that role, see how that character would respond that the situation.

And personally i think Elvis did that in the roles where he was allowed to stretch himself like King Creole, Flaming Star, Wild In The Country. He's not playing himself he is the character and in the end that is the goal.

We'll never know if acting lessons would have helped but one i thing i know would have was better roles, Elvis rose to challenges and honesty most of his movies were to easy for him, where was the challenge.

[Getlo]

Of course Elvis needed acting lessons if he wanted to improve his craft!

He was okay as an actor - as even most kids in school productions are - but there was never a moment on screen where you could say he was great. King Creole was hands down his best role, and he was very good in it. Very good, not great.

He had a basic, natural ability which cried out for proper attention and expansion. And screen presence like very few.

Yes, he could have been another one of the great actors of the 20th century. But no way in hell could he have done it alone.

[franny]

Yes many actors do take lessons-and many do not.
Acting lessons was the choice of Widmark and Paul Newman because they felt it was what they needed to improve their craft. But I can tell you they would never say "All people who want to act need lessons"
All people are different-and each does things best in the fashion which they are comfortable with.

Exactly. (y) Actor's like DeNiro and Pacino will actually watch someone firsthand in their profession to get a feel for the part they will play..What is right for one may not be right for another...

franny

[utmom2008]

Exactly. (y) Actor's like DeNiro and Pacino will actually watch someone firsthand in their profession to get a feel for the part they will play..What is right for one may not be right for another...

franny

I have read that too Franny. It makes me wonder who did Robert DeNiro study for the part of "Max Cady" in Cape Fear?:supriced::supriced:
My son had lunch with DeNiro last year...he said he was very nice, very very humble and soft spoken.(y)

[hounddog]

in answer to the original question, i guess no one will know for sure what roles Elvis was offered or not except Elvis, but i see no reason to doubt that he was offered these roles

[franny]

I have read that too Franny. It makes me wonder who did Robert DeNiro study for the part of "Max Cady" in Cape Fear?:supriced::supriced:
My son had lunch with DeNiro last year...he said he was very nice, very very humble and soft spoken.(y)

Yes, that would be interesting to find out. Also, how does he go about finding these people to study? :hmm:

Wow! :supriced: Rosanne, your son had lunch with DeNiro (y) That must have been something! It's so nice to hear he's very nice and humble, that's rare today :lol:

franny

[franny]

in answer to the original question, i guess no one will know for sure what roles Elvis was offered or not except Elvis, but i see no reason to doubt that he was offered these roles

I also see no reason to doubt he was offered those roles...(y)

franny

[utmom2008]

Wow! :supriced: Rosanne, your son had lunch with DeNiro (y) That must have been something! It's so nice to hear he's very nice and humble, that's rare today :lol:

franny

Last year my son was Student Body President at The University of Texas......Robert DeNiro donated alot of his awards(Academy Awards and such) to the college. So...Andrew and the President of UT and the Dean of the Theatre school gave him a tour of the campus and then took him to lunch. I was so envious...I have always liked him and I think he's about the best in the business when it comes to acting.(y)(y)

[franny]

Last year my son was Student Body President at The University of Texas......Robert DeNiro donated alot of his awards(Academy Awards and such) to the college. So...Andrew and the President of UT and the Dean of the Theatre school gave him a tour of the campus and then took him to lunch. I was so envious...I have always liked him and I think he's about the best in the business when it comes to acting.(y)(y)

I would so love to meet DeNiro. I agree he's about the best in the business, what an amazing actor. :notworthy Your son must have really enjoyed that day (y)

franny

[midnight]

Last year my son was Student Body President at The University of Texas......Robert DeNiro donated alot of his awards(Academy Awards and such) to the college. So...Andrew and the President of UT and the Dean of the Theatre school gave him a tour of the campus and then took him to lunch. I was so envious...I have always liked him and I think he's about the best in the business when it comes to acting.(y)(y)

Wow ,you guys have seen or met so many famous people! That is so cool!

[utmom2008]

Wow ,you guys have seen or met so many famous people! That is so cool!

I know.....:lol::D We have to follow Andrew's coat-tails to run around with the "big-wigs".:lol::lol::lol:

[utmom2008]

Wow ,you guys have seen or met so many famous people! That is so cool!

When Amy finished college and got a job in the State Capital in Austin she was invited to a political luncheon hosted by our Govenor. The "special guest" that day was Russell Crowe.....she said he was quite "cocky"...:lol:...no surprise there!:lol::lol:

[midnight]

I know.....:lol::D We have to follow Andrew's coat-tails to run around with the "big-wigs".:lol::lol::lol:

One day Andrew will be the "big-wig". Remember....'Mr President'.:lmfao:

[utmom2008]

One day Andrew will be the "big-wig". Remember....'Mr President'.:lmfao:

Yes....and The National Enquirer will run a story saying "our new President's Mother had an affair long ago with rock-n-roll legend Elvis Presley.":lol::lol::lmfao:

[midnight]

Yes....and The National Enquirer will run a story saying "our new President's Mother had an affair long ago with rock-n-roll legend Elvis Presley.":lol::lol::lmfao:

:lmfao::lmfao::lmfao:

[Brian]

He took an acting course not to learn according IMBD-but because he was told "No one flunks this course" and he was flunking most of his other courses. I was unaware of the LA Conservator of Music.
If you would like my friend, I will do a search "of all the actors who never took a lesson" and I will get out some of my biography collection and look up some. Is that really necessary? Jack Nicholson was a horrid actor in the eary days-When Jack Nicholson first came to Hollywood, he worked as a go-fer for animation legends Hanna-Barbera. Seeing his talent as an artist, they offered Nicholson a starting level position as an animation artist. However, citing his desire to become an actor, he turned them down
He made his film debut in a low-budget teen drama The Cry Baby Killer, in 1958, playing the title role.For the following decade,Nicholson was a frequent collaborator with the film's producer, Roger Corman. He learned film by doing b-movies with Corman and others. He has 3 Oscars and 12 nominations.
The point is -many actors- do not take- lessons. I can acknowledge others do take lessons-but not all actors do-or need to.
Many just start in pictures or fall into roles and learn as they go.

Jack Nicholson took acting lessons

he was taught by character actor Martin Landau

[EPguide]

I agree Houndog, Elvis did very well in some of those roles you mentioned. We really enjoyed the best of Elvis's movies at the cinemas.

Even if offered a role Formally it doesn't mean the actor would take up the role, or the movie be even made.

Hollywood history is a catalogue of lost opportunities for a great many people. There is no shortcut to this knowledge we just have to read hundreds of books and watch hundreds of Documentaries about the industry.

The great movie star Humphry Bogart, an intelligent man, was stuck with mediocre roles for the most part of his early career. I have just finished a fine biography and now have a beautiful large photo book of his whole life, bought just a few days ago.

We shall have to agree to differ on this subject. We all have our own views on a topic as open as this is to interpretation.

http://irelandtoo.blogspot.com