What would you have done?

[Donut]

This is not meant to start another heated discussion but after reading posts here for a long time I´m really curious about some things.
First of all what do you think were Elvis problems in his latest years wich made him go downhill.
And second what would you have done to help him if you were in his inner circle of friends/family.

[ksimms2]

I think his #1 problem was taking way too many pills. What I would have done, knowing he also had some other health problems, I would have taken him to a whole new and different doctor. Hoping this one would be strong enough to get the help he needed. I know ultimately it was up to Elvis to want help - but maybe if I could have gotten him away from Dr. Nick and the other doctors who basically gave him whatever he wanted - maybe that would have been a step in the right direction to get help. AND I would have video recorded him and how he acted and passing out, etc. and when he was sober would have played it back to him....I wonder had anyone thought of that back then?

[hounddog]

Mmm, I think Elvis like his mother suffered from a mild depression which was made worse by the meds he took. I also think he was over worked at times. I also think he wasn't challenged musically for a long time so a sense of boredom affected him.

So lets see what would i have done.

from all i've read about Elvis he didn't take to kindly to advice or help. So for starters it would be hard

So i guess I would tried to get him away from the Col that would have lead to hopefully him being more challenged with his career. this would hopefully lift his boredom and depression.

try to get him off the pills. Get him talking to someone about his feelings. get him touring in other countries and also just seeing other countries, play tourist.

Encourage him to write his own stuff be it movies, music whatever.

Keep his mind active Elvis was an intelligent man so maybe even encourage him to study.

I don't know that's a hard question isn't.

i know i'd be honest with him.

[rhythmknights]

i read the Duke Bardwell article someone posted in the OffTopics. i read the Mac Davis & Ronnie Tutt, Myrna Smith, and Joe Moscheo interviews. i also read an article where Pat Boone was interviewed. most of these can be found on the EP Australian webpage.
The idea i get from all thse interviews is this: the MM thought they were doing what Elvis wanted, they presumed that they knew him better than anyone else and none of them really understood Elvis at all. probably there were a lot of times when Elvis just wanted to be alone and rest and read. But i get the impression that he loved and needed to be around people. and he wanted to be able to be himself - just plain ole Elvis. he didn't want to constantly be 'on stage' and entertaining people, he wanted someone to entertain him. he didn't want a lot of yes men around him. but since they were yesmen, he was going to treat them as such. sometimes he played up to the hillbilly hick, but it was at the expense of whoever was dumb enough to buy it. And Elvis would be the one laughing all the way to the bank.

[utmom2008]

I think his #1 problem was taking way too many pills. What I would have done, knowing he also had some other health problems, I would have taken him to a whole new and different doctor. Hoping this one would be strong enough to get the help he needed. I know ultimately it was up to Elvis to want help - but maybe if I could have gotten him away from Dr. Nick and the other doctors who basically gave him whatever he wanted - maybe that would have been a step in the right direction to get help. AND I would have video recorded him and how he acted and passing out, etc. and when he was sober would have played it back to him....I wonder had anyone thought of that back then?
:lol: :lol: Great idea Kelly! Like David Hasselhoff's daughter did! (y) (y)

[ksimms2]

:lol: :lol: Great idea Kelly! Like David Hasselhoff's daughter did! (y) (y)

yes because the addict (whether it's drugs or alcohol or whatever) doesn't ever think others can tell they are under the influence. So I'd record him and show him. Not that it would make him quit - but maybe make him think twice.?

[Dorothy]

I would have him take a year off of working. Take him to Hawaii ( just because he loved it there ) Take maybe two trusted friends ( did he have any that he completly trusted ) ( no "yes" men ) and a good doctor that was experienced in that field. Find interesting things for him to do......something challenging. Encourage him to really talk about everything and anything.

Maybe by getting away from the pressures of being Elvis would have helped.

[rhythmknights]

I would have him take a year off of working. Take him to Hawaii ( just because he loved it there ) Take maybe two trusted friends ( did he have any that he completly trusted ) ( no "yes" men ) and a good doctor that was experienced in that field. Find interesting things for him to do......something challenging. Encourage him to really talk about everything and anything.

Maybe by getting away from the pressures of being Elvis would have helped.

yeah! get a bunch of pickup football games going and get him excersing without realizing he's getting into shape and just keep him busy. that diet of his would be a hard thing to break, tho. can you imagine a second comeback with Elvis, in shape(not necessarily skinny!), tan and his voice better than ever? WOW!! if Tony Bennett can come back in the 90's and 00's so could Elvis. elvis was one hardheaded, singleminded guy! i know that he would want to keep his music career in tact.

[Unchained Melody]

Of course I would've tried to help him if I was in the inner cirlce or one of his close friends. But a quote from Billy Smith.."How can you help a person, if they don't want to help themselves"..simply, you can't.(n)

[GirlHappy19]

I think that he suffered from depression like we all do.We have our ups and downs and let's face it---the guy was not like us.Like he said to Prescilla"Normal'?You want me to be normal"I can't go anywere without being chased"Then,he pointed at his windows all closed.Stardom came to him to early and too fast.His dear and beloved mother dies too soon.He was inducted into the army---things were happening too fast for him.His movie contract wasted alot of his time.A few movies were good and let's face it.Some were terrible.They were akk musical--wich he hate it.His marriage fail.So,he had plenty to be sad at times.But I see alot of pictures that show a very happy Elvis with a fantantastic sence of humor..And I don't know if it happends to any of you---if you have a party lots of your friends come ----if you need help moving ---maybe three will show up,but if you're depressed is like people don't want to be around....Like the songs goes__"nobody loves you when you're down?There is also something that probably cross his mind alot--
like"Do they love me cause of my fame and money?How many would stay if I had nothing?.......I would just respect his silence and let him know that I was there in good times as well as bad times....I don't know---I hate to think that Elvis was unhappy.

Giovanna

[cameron]

There were a lot of things going on in Elvis' life in the '70's , especially the last 2 years . Most has never even been discussed .
When we go back and see what Elvis was dealing with ,maybe then we can understand.
Most of us have only been exposed to the "glitz and glamour" of the MM and the drug stories. No problems he had at the time has ever been dealt with. Until that is brought out , there is much most of us have missed, IMO.

Depression played a big part . But, he had much to be depressed about.
Go back and see what was going on in his private life at that time.
It would destroy even a much bigger man, IMO.
He even called the one about to publish EWH and offered to help him.

I agree that "you can't help a man that won't help himself."
I mean something entirely different than the people that said this.

[Donut]

Thanks for your comments.
Another of the reasons for asking this is I find very laughable how some ie. musicians, associates, non inner circle friends claim to have known and understand him better than the ones that were with him almost 24 hours a day. Maybe they could have tried harder to help him but I can´t see those that critisize the MM did better or even tried to do it themselves.
I think Sonny and Red were amongs the few that had the guts for comfronting Elvis and that could be one of the reasons for firing them.
In my opinion a lot of physical problems and the state of mind he was in were closely related to his addiction and I would have told him if I were in the position till I get blue in the face. It had no sense standing by him for fear of getting fired, it didn´t help him either. I think the key of all this could have been Vernon and Col. Parker but they didn´t want to because they depended big time on him...

[Getlo]

I think Sonny and Red were amongs the few that had the guts for comfronting Elvis and that could be one of the reasons for firing them.

It was the main reason for the firings.

Red and Sonny attempted several times to stop the drug supplies, and to confront the suppliers.

They also confronted Elvis himself, many times.

He didn't like that, and became more and more pissed off when they kept trying.

He used the lawsuits caused by the MM as an excuse; Vernon wasn't smart enough to believe otherwise. Or, maybe he was, but chose to keep quiet and go along with the firings.

After all their efforts, the Red and Sonny's anger at being fired like that was completely justified. They were dismissed in a low, cowardly manner.

Critics of the MM say they were "bad friends".

So was Elvis.

[Donut]

Didn´t Red go to one of the supliers house (one of the gospel choir?) and threatened him to break his legs if he continued providing stuff to Elvis?
Good for Red man.

[Getlo]

Didn´t Red go to one of the supliers house (one of the gospel choir?) and threatened him to break his legs if he continued providing stuff to Elvis?

Not sure if it was at the guy's house or somewhere like Vegas, but yeah, that's the story.

Red stood up for Elvis, right from high school, and continues to do so to this day!

[MissyM]

Nothing. I've dealt with addicts and unless they want help you can not help them. First step (admitting you have a problem) came to late for Elvis. I think she was seriously entertaining the idea.
We can all play "Monday Morning Quarterback" but that action is filled with wishing, wanting, and fantasy.
So aside from loving, supporting any move to recovery, and just being a friend, I don't see another alternative. And that is what the MM did. Yes, some did it in a tuff love sort of way. (giving the benefit of the doubt here because I never talked to Red or Sonny myself) But if people think it was so much to profit themselves then all of them would be sitting on a million but they aren't. Only a select few are.

[Suzan]

It was the main reason for the firings.

Red and Sonny attempted several times to stop the drug supplies, and to confront the suppliers.

They also confronted Elvis himself, many times.

He didn't like that, and became more and more pissed off when they kept trying.

He used the lawsuits caused by the MM as an excuse; Vernon wasn't smart enough to believe otherwise. Or, maybe he was, but chose to keep quiet and go along with the firings.

After all their efforts, the Red and Sonny's anger at being fired like that was completely justified. They were dismissed in a low, cowardly manner.

Critics of the MM say they were "bad friends".

So was Elvis.

I agree, all the way up to the last part, only because, Sonny has said that Elvis wanted to give them a large severance pkg. and instructed Vernon to do so, and of course we now know Vernon didn't...and he also had intentions of hiring them back but again Vernon never told them that...and w/Elvis relying on everyone else to do as he asked and quite possibly trusting his dad the most, he assumed his wishes were carried out...should Elvis had made sure it was done and checked w/Sonny & Red, sure, but w/the state of affairs at that point, I'm not surprised he didn't.

I also heard that he went to the guys house.

I don't know enough about Red, you don't hear much from him, am looking forward to interview w/him, but I like Sonny a whole lot.

Great posts Donut and Getlo as usual!(y)

[Suzan]

Nothing. I've dealt with addicts and unless they want help you can not help them. First step (admitting you have a problem) came to late for Elvis. I think she was seriously entertaining the idea.
We can all play "Monday Morning Quarterback" but that action is filled with wishing, wanting, and fantasy.
So aside from loving, supporting any move to recovery, and just being a friend, I don't see another alternative. And that is what the MM did. Yes, some did it in a tuff love sort of way. (giving the benefit of the doubt here because I never talked to Red or Sonny myself) But if people think it was so much to profit themselves then all of them would be sitting on a million but they aren't. Only a select few are.

True that....about the addictions. And yes it is pure wishing and "what if" on our parts, but it's good topic I think. IMO :)

[Getlo]

But if people think it was so much to profit themselves then all of them would be sitting on a million but they aren't.

Exactly.

Anyone who think the MM wrote What Happened for the money is living in a fool's paradise.

If it was for money, they'd have taken the substantial bribe offered by Elvis not to publish it.

Steve Dunleavy made more money with his sensationalistic angles than the MM did relating their stories to him.

[Donut]

Nothing. I've dealt with addicts and unless they want help you can not help them. First step (admitting you have a problem) came to late for Elvis. I think she was seriously entertaining the idea.
We can all play "Monday Morning Quarterback" but that action is filled with wishing, wanting, and fantasy.
So aside from loving, supporting any move to recovery, and just being a friend, I don't see another alternative. And that is what the MM did. Yes, some did it in a tuff love sort of way. (giving the benefit of the doubt here because I never talked to Red or Sonny myself) But if people think it was so much to profit themselves then all of them would be sitting on a million but they aren't. Only a select few are.

I know this is all wishing and fantasy MissyM and everyone at that moment made what they thought would be best (?).
But not always the one that has the problem is the only one able to help itself. Some people accept the help when the ones around the addict stand together and made the person feel trapped. I have seen that happened near me. The problem in my opinion is some tried it and the others refused to stand by their side for whatever reasons.

[MissyM]

And you know what probably would have happened had they done that, they all would have been fired. Then what?? I'm not saying I don't understand what you are saying. But we are so much more informed these days about intervention and how to deal with these things. I look back at my loved ones who drank and think, if only I knew back then what I know now. It's just to hard to do that. It all boils down to the fact that it was not up to me. But that is just my opinion. I have wishes galore in my bag but those wishes only lead me to the path of guilt. I had to move past that because that is very much part of the co-dependancy process, (the blaming). I am fragile in that part of me wants to return. Because I get angry at my people. If I can blame me, then I don't have to blame them. See what I mean. I just think forgiveness is a better avenue. It brings me peace all around.

[Suzan]

Exactly.

Anyone who think the MM wrote What Happened for the money is living in a fool's paradise.

If it was for money, they'd have taken the substantial bribe offered by Elvis not to publish it.

Steve Dunleavy made more money with his sensationalistic angles than the MM did relating their stories to him.

I don't think they hardly made anything did they?

Absolutely Dunleavy made the bucks.

I used to think they did it for money because Sonny once said that they were out of jobs, and nothing coming in, so I just thought, oh they wrote the book to float them til they found another job, but have since changed my opinion after reading more about the book deal, publisher and Dunleavy.

Very true Donut, my nephew is going thru that now.:(
I think the other's didn't stand by them because they were afraid for their bread and butter, they didn't want to lose their lifestyles, etc...

I think out of all of them the one that is sitting on most of the money from his affiliation is Joe Esposito and Jerry Schilling, I think anyway.

[Suzan]

And you know what probably would have happened had they done that, they all would have been fired. Then what?? I'm not saying I don't understand what you are saying. But we are so much more informed these days about intervention and how to deal with these things. I look back at my loved ones who drank and think, if only I knew back then what I know now. It's just to hard to do that. It all boils down to the fact that it was not up to me. But that is just my opinion. I have wishes galore in my bag but those wishes only lead me to the path of guilt. I had to move past that because that is very much part of the co-dependancy process, (the blaming). I am fragile in that part of me wants to return. Because I get angry at my people. If I can blame me, then I don't have to blame them. See what I mean. I just think forgiveness is a better avenue. It brings me peace all around.

TOTALLY get what your saying...we're going thru similar situation now w/my nephew.

[MissyM]

It's such a helpless feeling and I don't wish it on anyone. I used to scream into a pillow I'd be so frustrated. Watching someone you love self-distruct and not be able to do anything about it, is the worst feeling in the world. You just want to shake them and say, "Stop, you're killing yourself and me too just watching you." Being there giving unconditional love took all the strength I ever had. And I often failed to have that strength. I was only human. I guess that is why I so understand how Linda just had to leave.

[Suzan]

It's such a helpless feeling and I don't wish it on anyone. I used to scream into a pillow I'd be so frustrated. Watching someone you love self-distruct and not be able to do anything about it, is the worst feeling in the world. You just want to shake them and say, "Stop, you're killing yourself and me too just watching you." Being there giving unconditional love took all the strength I ever had. And I often failed to have that strength. I was only human. I guess that is why I so understand how Linda just had to leave.

OMG totally...and when we did get him to agree to go to rehab we were sooo ecstatic, to only have that happiness pop a week later when he checked himself out, and like you said, you just want to throttle them and scream "Look at what you are doing to yourself and those around you, is it worth it?"...am very scared that we will lose him. His mom is at her wits end.

[MissyM]

I will remember you all in my prayers. I feel for ya'll.

[Donut]

It's such a helpless feeling and I don't wish it on anyone. I used to scream into a pillow I'd be so frustrated. Watching someone you love self-distruct and not be able to do anything about it, is the worst feeling in the world. You just want to shake them and say, "Stop, you're killing yourself and me too just watching you." Being there giving unconditional love took all the strength I ever had. And I often failed to have that strength. I was only human. I guess that is why I so understand how Linda just had to leave.

I get what you say. That situation can be really frustrating.
As for Linda according to some MM and her friend Jeanne Lemay´s recent book it was more a matter that Elvis didn´t want her around anymore and could very well be for the same reason he didn´t want to be with Sonny and Red.
The thing is how many people would have been Elvis able to fire once they were all fired? LOL

[ksimms2]

I would have him take a year off of working. Take him to Hawaii ( just because he loved it there ) Take maybe two trusted friends ( did he have any that he completly trusted ) ( no "yes" men ) and a good doctor that was experienced in that field. Find interesting things for him to do......something challenging. Encourage him to really talk about everything and anything.

Maybe by getting away from the pressures of being Elvis would have helped.

Great idea Dorothy!! (y)

[Suzan]

I will remember you all in my prayers. I feel for ya'll.

Thank you.
Wow, this is the first time I've publicly addressed it, usually I keep my private stuff private.

[Suzan]

I get what you say. That situation can be really frustrating.
As for Linda according to some MM and her friend Jeanne Lemay´s recent book it was more a matter that Elvis didn´t want her around anymore and could very well be for the same reason he didn´t want to be with Sonny and Red.
The thing is how many people would have been Elvis able to fire once they were all fired? LOL

I to heard he broke it off w/her and bought her an apartment in L.A. as sort of a partying gift?????
LOL makes you wonder that last part huh?

[Donut]

OMG totally...and when we did get him to agree to go to rehab we were sooo ecstatic, to only have that happiness pop a week later when he checked himself out, and like you said, you just want to throttle them and scream "Look at what you are doing to yourself and those around you, is it worth it?"...am very scared that we will lose him. His mom is at her wits end.

At least they will never have to live with the ugly feeling that they did nothing.
Wishing you and your nephew all the best Suzan. Don´t give up because addictions can be overcome and it happens everyday, it´s a fact.

[SleepyJack]

I doubt if Elvis could have got the help he needed from anyone iside his "circle"....he had too much control over them and probably no fear of any of them.I don`t know if it would have helped but maybe he needed some out and out criticism from people that he respected,be it from the entertainment industry or from religious leaders or whatever......Who knows, maybe some small comment or criticism might have clicked with him?.......

[KPM]

It was the main reason for the firings.

Red and Sonny attempted several times to stop the drug supplies, and to confront the suppliers.

They also confronted Elvis himself, many times.

He didn't like that, and became more and more pissed off when they kept trying.

He used the lawsuits caused by the MM as an excuse; Vernon wasn't smart enough to believe otherwise. Or, maybe he was, but chose to keep quiet and go along with the firings.
After all their efforts, the Red and Sonny's anger at being fired like that was completely justified. They were dismissed in a low, cowardly manner.

Critics of the MM say they were "bad friends".

So was Elvis.
As I have pointed out the lawsuit filed in 74 for 6.4 million against Elvis is discussed in "Elvis Up Close" and in Rev. of the MM both books say he settled out of court-In "Elvis Up Close" the figure $600,000 is the settlement mentioned, which is a huge chunk of change.(this did not include the legal fees involved in a lawsuit like this) Regardless there were lawsuits and at least this one had an apparent big price tag.
The lawsuits may not have been the only reason-but a case can be made that "lawsuits were one of the reasons".

[cameron]

Thanks, KPM. I agree. No one looks to see what was going on ,what trouble Red & Sonny caused.
There was much more that's never been discussed because no one wants tio believe anything except what's been in books .
I just gave up talking . IMO, most keep their heads in the sand and never bothers to find the truth. :'(

[Unchained Melody]

It was the main reason for the firings.

Red and Sonny attempted several times to stop the drug supplies, and to confront the suppliers.

They also confronted Elvis himself, many times.

He didn't like that, and became more and more pissed off when they kept trying.

He used the lawsuits caused by the MM as an excuse; Vernon wasn't smart enough to believe otherwise. Or, maybe he was, but chose to keep quiet and go along with the firings.

After all their efforts, the Red and Sonny's anger at being fired like that was completely justified. They were dismissed in a low, cowardly manner.

Critics of the MM say they were "bad friends".

So was Elvis.

Getlo I must say you know your stuff when it comes to Elvis and I have to agree with everything you've written here. The fans give the MM way to much of a hard time. Imagine being in their position in the end..trying to keep Elvis alive, and trying to help him straighten up (Just Like The Red West Incident) and they still get bashed as "free Loaders" etc...that upsets me.

[utmom2008]

OMG totally...and when we did get him to agree to go to rehab we were sooo ecstatic, to only have that happiness pop a week later when he checked himself out, and like you said, you just want to throttle them and scream "Look at what you are doing to yourself and those around you, is it worth it?"...am very scared that we will lose him. His mom is at her wits end.
I am sorry to hear that Suzan. That is a long and lonely road sometimes. I'll be thinking of you and your family...

[Diane]

The first thing I would have done in 1968 is to enlist Steve Binder's help in putting real strong pressure on Elvis to let him or to get some else as capable to replace the Colonel as his agent.....make him an offer he couldn't refuse. :D

After that, I would have encouraged Elvis to talk and give him a lot of emotional support in hopes that he would listen and eventually trust me enough to be able to talk to him about the harm the drugs would cause him later on.

Hopefully with a new manager and new overseas tours to stimulate his interest he would not have felt the need for the drugs as much.

Diane

[JDD]

Thats a pretty good ideal. Having delt with someone who was addicted before, He would no doubt blow up at you for doing it, as he did when
they would confront him with words, but better that then the alternative.

JD





I think his #1 problem was taking way too many pills. What I would have done, knowing he also had some other health problems, I would have taken him to a whole new and different doctor. Hoping this one would be strong enough to get the help he needed. I know ultimately it was up to Elvis to want help - but maybe if I could have gotten him away from Dr. Nick and the other doctors who basically gave him whatever he wanted - maybe that would have been a step in the right direction to get help. AND I would have video recorded him and how he acted and passing out, etc. and when he was sober would have played it back to him....I wonder had anyone thought of that back then?

[Unchained Melody]

It's such a helpless feeling and I don't wish it on anyone. I used to scream into a pillow I'd be so frustrated. Watching someone you love self-distruct and not be able to do anything about it, is the worst feeling in the world. You just want to shake them and say, "Stop, you're killing yourself and me too just watching you." .

Exactly. That's the position the guys around Elvis were in. People would say why didn't you try to help him..well they did, Elvis did not want theres or anyone elses help, sadly.. and yet they still get bashed around the clock..:(

[Suzan]

Thank you very much Donut for your kind words. I sure hope so because he is awfully young, only 20, I hope he sees that if he doesn't stop it will kill him, he's already lost 2 friends to an overdose and a third one barely made it.:( Has it scared him? Not one bit.

Thanks utmom...:)

I don't think, speaking for myself only, that I have my head in the sand or anywhere else where Elvis or the MM are concerned, or anyone else around Elvis for that matter, however, there is always 2 sides to any story, and though yes the lawsuits did take place, they weren't the sole reasons for the firings, nor were the firings the reason Sonny & Red wrote the book, I am not going to address Hebler because of my views about him and the fact that he was not around long enough, he may have been in awe of Elvis but I don't think he had the same feelings and connection to Elvis that the rest did, I know some may say that 3 yrs. or whatever is not a short time, but it is when compared to some who had been there since the early days of his career or those that attended high school with him. And per Sonny, Elvis wasn't to crazy about Hebler either, not trusting him, and from what I've heard of Elvis he had a pretty good sense about people, most of the time.

I think it's grossly unfair to lump people into one comment, it's not fair to any of the fans, irregardless on which side of the issue they stand. IMO.

[jak]

Nobody was going to help Elvis.If he wouldnt listen to the friends he had since childhood or his father it was useless.Nobody told Elvis what to do in his personal life whether it was good advice or not.He was just bent on self destruction.If he wasnt he never would have let himself get to the point where his problems were glaringly obvious to the public.
The true nature of the firings of Red and Sonny will always be debated.I just dont think that lawsuits or money would have been enough to cause Elvis to fire them.I dont think he cared about the money.If anything I think Elvis would have circled the wagons rather than fire Red over monetary reasons.Dont forget it was Elvis who empowered those guys.They were all living out their macho tough guy fantasies with Elvis as the head cheerleader.An instance of heavy handed behaviour wasnt going to cut the ties between Elvis and Red.Elvis was extremely loyal.Probably to a fault.Them getting fired for trying to help Elvis and their continous interference in his problem seems most logical to me.Elvis' problems made him irrational.I will always say Red was the greatest friend he ever had.
Jak

[Getlo]

There was much more that's never been discussed because no one wants tio believe anything except what's been in books .
I just gave up talking . IMO, most keep their heads in the sand and never bothers to find the truth. :'(

Your condescension is genuinely astounding at times.

And "there was much more that's never been discussed"?

Do tell, as you make it out like you have inside information.

[Suzan]

Your condescension is genuinely astounding at times.

And "there was much more that's never been discussed"?

Do tell, as you make it out like you have inside information.

I was a bit astounded myself.:(:(
I think everything pretty much has been discussed...well all that they care to address.
Pris (yeah I can't believe I'm going to quote her either lol) once said to Maria Shriver (I have the interview on VHS) when asked by Maria about Elvis, "I've said all I can say, what more can be said?" that's a condensed quote, she also stated that he should be left alone to rest in peace...yeah I won't touch that one. LOL

[cameron]

Your condescension is genuinely astounding at times.

And "there was much more that's never been discussed"?

Do tell, as you make it out like you have inside information.

No "inside info" as some claim. I just look further than "sex and drugs."

There's more to this whole thing than some think. It's in court records etc.
Go find it.:)

[Suzan]

No "inside info" as some claim. I just look further than "sex and drugs."

There's more to this whole thing than some think. It's in court records etc.
Go find it.:)

No claims...fact...and those of us who've said things have actually shown proof of it, so please please please stop w/the snide remarks, if you don't have "inside" info don't abuse those that do, thank you for your kind understanding.
It's getting very tiresome the personal attacks and snide jabs.
Also, speaking for myself, I have shown proof of everything I've said, I'm sad that other's haven't or can't do same, as your response to Getlo shows.:(

[Getlo]

There's more to this whole thing than some think. It's in court records etc.
Go find it.:)

Oh, court records. Like the Graceland highway thing, or the Zippin Pippin.

Please, if there was "more to this whole thing than was discussed" it would have been out in the open years ago.

[cameron]

No claims...fact...and those of us who've said things have actually shown proof of it, so please please please stop w/the snide remarks, if you don't have "inside" info don't abuse those that do, thank you for your kind understanding.
It's getting very tiresome the personal attacks and snide jabs.
Also, speaking for myself, I have shown proof of everything I've said, I'm sad that other's haven't or can't do same, as your response to Getlo shows.:(

I've not said anything to you. Court records show proof, with no "he said, she said."

[cameron]

Oh, court records. Like the Graceland highway thing, or the Zippin Pippin.

Please, if there was "more to this whole thing than was discussed" it would have been out in the open years ago.

The court records are out in the open. I just went further than the "sex and drugs." Nothing to do with the highway or the Zippin Pippin.:blink:

[Suzan]

I've not said anything to you. Court records show proof, with no "he said, she said."

Ok.
Of which by the way in your own words you stated could not be obtained.:)
There is no he said/she said....quite a few of us here have backed every single thing we've said, we just wish that other's would as well instead of referencing documents that cannot be obtained, and if it is on the net, please do post, as we've done, I personally am tired of doing the leg work of the naysayers, who then in turn won't return the kindness when it's asked of them.
BTW I'm utterly lost as to what court records have anything to do w/a topic that asks "What would you have done"? Am I missing something?Why must every thread turn to this, if there is nothing constructive to say or proof can't be shown take it up privately via pm or just don't say anything at all. There are plenty of wonderful threads here to chose from, thank goodness. IMO :D

[cameron]

The court records I speak of are on the Net. Unfortunately, there are many who will not show their proof, so as they tell me:Go look for yourself.:)

We are indeed OFF TOPIC here. I apologize to others.

[Suzan]

The court records I speak of are on the Net. Unfortunately, there are many who will not show their proof, so as they tell me:Go look for yourself.:)

We are indeed OFF TOPIC here. I apologize to others.

Ok, well that's fine. I'm still confuzzled as to how court records and he said/she said come into play on this topic, as I stated in my above post. A

Anyhooo, I don't know what I would have done, different or otherwise as I can't even fathom being in that position. I think all who were around him did the best they could for him and themselves that they knew at the time, there is a reason for the term "hindsight is 20/20". :)

[cameron]

I believe that all those around Elvis should have not worried about getting fired if they were truly concerned about Elvis.
IF all had walked out on him; he might have woke up to the fact that no one was going to put up with him until and unless he made the decision to get some good medical help.
And yes, I would have done that . (y)

BTW: post #32 took us off topic.;)

[Getlo]

BTW: post #32 took us off topic.;)

It was probably post #11 ... which fails to address what you would have done to help Elvis.


There were a lot of things going on in Elvis' life in the '70's , especially the last 2 years . Most has never even been discussed .
When we go back and see what Elvis was dealing with ,maybe then we can understand.
Most of us have only been exposed to the "glitz and glamour" of the MM and the drug stories. No problems he had at the time has ever been dealt with. Until that is brought out , there is much most of us have missed, IMO.

Depression played a big part . But, he had much to be depressed about.
Go back and see what was going on in his private life at that time.
It would destroy even a much bigger man, IMO.
He even called the one about to publish EWH and offered to help him.

I agree that "you can't help a man that won't help himself."
I mean something entirely different than the people that said this.

[cameron]

At the first part I was agreeing with KPM.
At the end I believe that I did address that what I would/could have done to help Elvis.

"Depression played a big part . But, he had much to be depressed about.
Go back and see what was going on in his private life at that time.
It would destroy even a much bigger man, IMO.
He even called the one about to publish EWH and offered to help him.

I agree that "you can't help a man that won't help himself."
I mean something entirely different than the people that said this."

I couldn't have done a darn thing as he had much going on in his life to be depressed about, IMO.Evidently, things none of the MM knew or at least never talk about. :)

[MissyM]

Some people assume that the MM didn't want to risk losing their jobs because of the lifestyle. I see it differently. Sometimes all you can do is be there when someone is troubled and won't listen. And had some of them not been there, he would have died sooner. Sometimes the lack of credit for that bugs me. It must have been so frightening for them. Yet they stayed hoping to rescue Elvis, should he have a close call. I'm just not sure I could have done that. There was a real trade off for being his friend and working for him. (in so many ways) Would you have been willing to hang???? I guess you first have to be religiously honest about what the situation was, really put yourself in their shoes, before you answer.

[Getlo]

Go back and see what was going on in his private life at that time.
It would destroy even a much bigger man, IMO.

Oh boo hoo. Poor Elvis. He was dealing with a divorce, and a drug problem that was spiralling slowly out of control. In the grand scheme of things (and to paraphrase Casablanca) his problems weren't worth a hill of beans. There are millions of people who dealt with bigger things than Elvis Presley had on his plate.


He even called the one about to publish EWH and offered to help him.

To which "one" are you referring? And what "help" did Elvis offer him?

[cameron]

It's because that is always said about the MM. "they would lose their jobs ,if they crossed Elvis" It was actually Elvis himself that told them too ,they could look for other jobs .

I love my kids more than my own life; but if any of them said anything like that to me; I would have have walked away too.
Otherwise; it's as has been said ...you would be an "Inabler."
Sometimes, it takes hard decisions to wake someone up; especially when it comes to drugs or alchohol. :'(

[Suzan]

I believe that all those around Elvis should have not worried about getting fired if they were truly concerned about Elvis.
IF all had walked out on him; he might have woke up to the fact that no one was going to put up with him until and unless he made the decision to get some good medical help.
And yes, I would have done that . (y)

BTW: post #32 took us off topic.;)

But those men had families to worry about as well, and for all that would have MAYBE gotten fired, how many do you think would be in line waiting to do EXACTLY what Elvis Presley asked of them?

I happened to agree w/some of post #32...not all but some.



MissyM Some people assume that the MM didn't want to risk losing their jobs because of the lifestyle. I see it differently. Sometimes all you can do is be there when someone is troubled and won't listen. And had some of them not been there, he would have died sooner. Sometimes the lack of credit for that bugs me. It must have been so frightening for them. Yet they stayed hoping to rescue Elvis, should he have a close call. I'm just not sure I could have done that. There was a real trade off for being his friend and working for him. (in so many ways) Would you have been willing to hang???? I guess you first have to be religiously honest about what the situation was, really put yourself in their shoes, before you answer.

I used that term for lack of a better way to convey what I was thinking. These men had families to consider as well, and majority of their life was spent w/Elvis, they knew only that position, you know what I'm trying to convey? lol...Absolutely that is all you can do, I agree, like I've said we're in similar situation now w/a family member.
It's hard to say if he'd died sooner, just like it's hard to say if someone had checked on him sooner on that August day would he have lived and if so for how long? I'm sure the situation was frightening, no doubt in my mind, but some were of mindset how do you rescue someone from himself, to me that says that they weren't there for the reason's you mentioned.:(
There is a trade off to everything in life...sure it was challenging to being his friend and employed by him, but I think what the guys got out of it far outweighed that, in the good days prior to '76...they were all right there for the party but some who claim to have loved him, where were they in '76? Either working for the Col. or in L.A. doing their thing, they knew to be there during the good times, why did the leave for the bad? I always say, if someone is a dear friend of mine, if I can laugh w/them I most certainly can cry with them.
Knowing the situation, that is tough because we weren't there, but if I were to base my answer in all I've heard and read, yes I would have stayed...if that meant coming to terms that he was going to die, my answer is still yes, because he deserved that, if he'd done for me what he did for some of those guys, absolutely a resounding yes, I would not have budged, if I had to hold him while he slipped away, yes, he deserved that...to me the situation is akin to a family member dying of an incurable disease, you know the day is coming, are you going to leave and let them die alone because you can't face it? To me that is a very selfish thing.
Billy didn't leave, Billy stayed til the end, right by his cousin's side...for that I have the utmost respect and love for him, even though I've neither spoken w/him or met him, but if I had the honor and privilage that is what I would thank Billy Smith for and give him a great big hug!
I think if Sonny and Red had been given the chance, they to would have done it.
Right or wrong, that is my stand on this topic. :)

[cameron]

Oh boo hoo. Poor Elvis. He was dealing with a divorce, and a drug problem that was spiralling slowly out of control. In the grand scheme of things (and to paraphrase Casablanca) his problems weren't worth a hill of beans. There are millions of people who dealt with bigger things than Elvis Presley had on his plate.



To which "one" are you referring? And what "help" did Elvis offer him?

Look for yourself. It's you that claim to know everything.
I just like to dig deeper . :)

[Getlo]

Look for yourself. It's you that claim to know everything. I just like to dig deeper . :)

I see. And could you direct me to exactly where I claimed to know everything? Which thread was this, exactly?

No, it's you getting miffed that I can back up every one of my claims with actual evidence.

As I have said a hundred times on here: you made the claim, you provide your evidence. As for "looking it up myself": well, I'd certianly need a lot more info than you've had the courtesy to provide. Maybe Google under "Elvis, call, help"?

Elvis made no such phonecall offering "help" to a member of the MM. More hearsay and rumour. Unless of course, you can provide proof of this? I'd like to read it.

Unless, of course, you're talking about the supposedly taped conversation with Red. That's old news.

http://jordans-elvis-world.com/audio/red/redphone.htm

[cameron]

Yes, Getlo. Congrats !! (y)(y)
Everything is "old news" that pertains to Elvis.

[Getlo]

I just gave up talking.

;)


He even called the one about to publish EWH and offered to help him.

Which is a clear indication that i) Elvis was prepared to forgive Red for anything he'd supposedly done to Elvis and ii) that Elvis obviously knew that What Happened was absolutely true. Had it not been, Elvis would have launched legal action against the boys. But he didn't.

[MissyM]

Suzan, you make some very good points. I'm not sure I could have stayed. I only say that being honest with myself. If in doubt, I won't say I would. I think there are people who have the strength to hang but I also think some who don't act like they could. I'm not saying I would not have remained friends, it's being in the thick of it, I'm not sure I could have handled. But I see what you mean about being there for the good and not so good. For Linda it was entirely different because of the relationship she had with him. Lots of extra factors to consider.

[kellyelvis]

I think Elvis had to hide behind too many charades. all the women/ the late nights the parties etc all that was a mask to hide behind to keep everyone else happy. He gave everything to anyone yet sacrificed his happiness in the process. I bet no body sat him down and asked what he wants for once. Everything was decided for him he couldnt go out (A cos his fans just mob him and (b he wasnt allowed to do anything without the Colonels say so. Even his marriage he felt obliged cos he had to keep a promise made to Cillas dad. All he wanted was a friend he couldrely on in 2 second they were marrying him off to her. nothing was his choice he must of felt he didnt have a choice. the only control he had over was food and pills he cld control those himself.
All he wanted was someone to love him for him not use him then dump him.
I would never have walked out on him.

"I am tired of being Elvis Presley" Elvis 1976 on recording the 'Moody Blue' Albulm

[cameron]

All this is "OFF TOPIC" .

[jak]

"Depression played a big part . But, he had much to be depressed about.
Go back and see what was going on in his private life at that time.
It would destroy even a much bigger man, IMO."

I gotta strongly disagree with this one.Elvis had some problems in his life just like everyone.They were however absolutely nothing compared to what many everyday people face all the time.Being Elvis may have created some problems but it sure took away many problems also.The average guy and family have to face much more adversity than he ever had to.I cant feel sorry for Elvis in this dept.If he couldnt cope with the personal diffuculties he faces that was just a personal weakness.His personal issues were not that severe.I would say many a lesser man has survived much more than he did.
Jak

[cameron]

"Depression played a big part . But, he had much to be depressed about.
Go back and see what was going on in his private life at that time.
It would destroy even a much bigger man, IMO."

I gotta strongly disagree with this one.Elvis had some problems in his life just like everyone.They were however absolutely nothing compared to what many everyday people face all the time.Being Elvis may have created some problems but it sure took away many problems also.The average guy and family have to face much more adversity than he ever had to.I cant feel sorry for Elvis in this dept.If he couldnt cope with the personal diffuculties he faces that was just a personal weakness.His personal issues were not that severe.I would say many a lesser man has survived much more than he did.
Jak

You are free to disagree all you want. This is what some call a "discussion"
Albeit : OFF TOPIC .
Start another thread that relates and I'll answer.

Depression is a big health issue, IMO. I'd still walk away from him !!
If all would have, I believe he might have had "a wake up call."
Maybe not; it would just be a chance one has to take.
You can always return to help and support him as he recuperates .

[LovesElvis]

I have struggled with depression myself (still struggling and being treated) and am surely glad no one walked away from me during those darkest times. It would've been understandable had they done so, but I thank my lucky stars every day that they stuck by me.

This is pure speculation, but we have so many treatment modalities for depression (I have no doubt that he was depressed, esp in the late 70s) that we didn't have then. I wonder if they would have made a difference.

[Suzan]

Suzan, you make some very good points. I'm not sure I could have stayed. I only say that being honest with myself. If in doubt, I won't say I would. I think there are people who have the strength to hang but I also think some who don't act like they could. I'm not saying I would not have remained friends, it's being in the thick of it, I'm not sure I could have handled. But I see what you mean about being there for the good and not so good. For Linda it was entirely different because of the relationship she had with him. Lots of extra factors to consider.

Very true what you said as well. I just think for the prev. reason's stated that I would have stayed. I really would.
Linda, as much as I like her, she didn't leave him, he broke it off according to quite a few of the guys around him. But again who knows, we weren't in the room.
I just think, irregardless of some opinions, Elvis was not the horrid person he is made out to be, like all of mankind he had faults, but he was a good person, and those around him weren't angels either, some have been honest in admitting their part in the partying, women and drugs and some not, but if it and he was as bad as some say, they would have left long before the mid 70's.

[MissyM]

OMGosh, Elvis was a great person in so many ways. That is a fact.

[presley31]

Elvis was a very special man no matter what has been said about him, he'll always have a place in my heart.

[LovesElvis]

Elvis was a very special man no matter what has been said about him, he'll always have a place in my heart.
Completely agreed.
He was human, as are we all. It's easy to forget that sometimes.

[Merry]

:hug:


Just keep loving him .........




19909


:hug:


Kimmi
xxxxxxxxxx
000000000

[Unchained Melody]

The fact is whats done is done. Theres nothing nobody could've done that would help E if he didn't want to be helped...and he obviously didn't, because when they tried Elvis would push them away and get pissed off.

He was human, made mistakes, lots of them. But we all do, I try not to dwell on the sad things in Elvis' life and enjoy what he left us to treasure, because thats what he would have wanted from his fans.

;)

[Jumpsuit Junkie]

The fact is Elvis needed enablers otherwise they would have been dispatched swiftly. Does anybody seriously think that Elvis did all the running around to seek out new doctors to supply him with the meds he wanted?

Elvis was responsible for his own destiny, I for one do not feel I am able to be judgemental about how he lived his life, could I have done any better given the same set of circumstances and with the information that was around at that time..... I'm not sure I could. Doctors were dishing out Valium like sweets back in the 70's to anyone who wanted them! I'm not justifying what Elvis did to himself just pointing out that the way we perceive doctors and the way drugs are viewed in 2007. We treat many drugs with suspicion today and have a much better understanding of how they effect people physically as well as phycologically, that information today would I believe have prevented Elvis' death.

Having said that it has been commented many times that Elvis was almost a qualified pharmacist through the books he read relating to meds. He might have known what they were used for and maybe some anecdotal effects, but the dependency robbed Elvis of objectivity and he succumb to the habit.

The fact that Elvis took drugs for many years without the effects being evident makes it hard for those around to justify making a stance when they have let Elvis do it for so long. Despite the bad rap the MM get I believe they were ill equipped to deal with Elvis' dependency even by 1972! The habit had already been formed over many years.

So, what could I have done that his Father, several Doctors and the MM hadn't already tried?

I'm afraid Elvis' life was a 'fête accompli' and I wouldn't be so arrogant to say that I could have made that difference as much as I would want too.

[cameron]

It is one thing to read a book {PDR} and quite another thing to be a doctor or a pharmacist. It's why both have years of schooling before being "let loose" on the public. ;)

I've known my doctor several years. I like it becaise I can call him with my symptoms ; but I leave it up to him what medications he orders.

As stated; the enablers were just as bad or worse in allowing everything to continue. Having worked in those kind of situations ; IMO , you can't help someone by "standing by them all the time."
It's quite different to offer love and support than to ignore the choice another makes.

Whether it be alchohol or drugs ; the person will have to make the decision to stop themselves. I had a son that had problems with alchohol . I let him know I loved him; but I never approved of what alchohol did to him.
When it got to the point he had to go to the hospital or be in serious trouble......his family and I were right there to support him .
Depression is just one symptom of other things that need attention.

Could I have helped Elvis? Not unless I could get everyone to leave him by himself to figure out what was more important to him. His drugs or the ones he loved and who loved him.

As has been stated; doctors gave out Valium and other things like candy .
So were the doctors to blame or the patients that put their trust in them ?

Even today ; pain meds, etc. are still abused by some. Thank goodness, the general public is more aware of the dangers of addiction to some drugs today.
Yet ,in some cases it still occurs .
Who's to blame ? :hmm:

[Getlo]

As stated; the enablers were just as bad or worse in allowing everything to continue. Having worked in those kind of situations ; IMO , you can't help someone by "standing by them all the time."

Yet, you condemn Sonny, red et al for not "standing by" Elvis towards the end, and going off to write their book.

And what about all those times when the boys were actively trying to stop the drug supply (don't be so naive as to say that never happened either) or when they confronted Elvis directly about his drug intake ... were they enablers then?

[cameron]

Yet, you condemn Sonny, red et al for not "standing by" Elvis towards the end, and going off to write their book.

And what about all those times when the boys were actively trying to stop the drug supply (don't be so naive as to say that never happened either) or when they confronted Elvis directly about his drug intake ... were they enablers then?

I condemn them for making money off of a friends problem.
I don't condemn them for leaving. {fired ,actually}
Read the phone call.

[Jumpsuit Junkie]

It is one thing to read a book {PDR} and quite another thing to be a doctor or a pharmacist. It's why both have years of schooling before being "let loose" on the public. ;)

Thank you for RE-STATING my comment ;);)


As stated; the enablers were just as bad or worse in allowing everything to continue.

I don't think the MM knew they were enablers! As stated the MM were NOT qualified to deal with Elvis' addictions, they were not psychologists! Some, if not all had their own demons to deal with.


Having worked in those kind of situations; IMO, you can't help someone by "standing by them all the time."
It's quite different to offer love and support than to ignore the choice another makes.

I think we have all heard the stories of the intervention the MM, Girlfriends and Dr. Nick had tried.... placebo's, detox in the hospital and confrontations etc. if it were as easy as your comments make it sound Elvis would survived Aug 16th 1977. I have lost count of how many times it has come up in threads where people say "you weren't there, how can you know". You are guilty of making these same assumptions with your comments :hmm:


Could I have helped Elvis? Not unless I could get everyone to leave him by himself to figure out what was more important to him. His drugs or the ones he loved and who loved him.

The fact that Red & Sonny were given the bullet after many years of loyal service disproves this theory, he would have found more enablers and carried on with the meds... as he did, addicts can always justify their actions :!:


As has been stated; doctors gave out Valium and other things like candy. So were the doctors to blame or the patients that put their trust in them?

A bit of a loaded question but the answer is 'Both'....... it was a mutual relationship we each benefiting from what the needed from each other.

[jak]

It's easy for us after 30 years to be able to look back and say we would have done this or they should have done this.Im sure it was much different actually being involved with someone of the magnitude of Elvis.He had a powerfull personality that dominated the people around him.Anybody that would think differently is being very naive.Elvis had to have it his way.Right or wrong.I give Red and Sonny and the others credit for what they did to help Elvis.It all comes down to Elvis being his own worst enemy.He wasnt a victim.he chose his course and had to deal with the consequences.
Jak

[Jumpsuit Junkie]

I condemn them for making money off of a friends problem.

The same "friend" who fired them?

Don't get me wrong here, Elvis had every right as an employer to hire and fire who he wanted, however Sonny and Red had been treated unfairly in the scheme of things and Elvis acknowledged that in the phone call to Red. It has always been said that Elvis would have hired these guys back at some point, when was that going to be? It had been quite some time and they hadn't heard from Elvis until the book EWH was in the pipeline.............

I love Elvis to bits but you have to be dispassionate when dealing with peoples lives, Elvis wasn't always the good guy. Despite our fierce loyalty for our guy, we have to admit he was no saint.

[Getlo]

It all comes down to Elvis being his own worst enemy.He wasnt a victim.he chose his course and had to deal with the consequences.

Right on. (y)

I'm sick of the "poor Elvis" mentality when it comes to the drugs, and even the What Happened book.

My only regret about that book is that Elvis didn't live long enough to be truly shamed and embarrassed by it into admitting he had a problem, and finding the guts to finally face his issues.

Then he probably would have lived longer, returned to making better music than he was at the end; then his life wouldn't be the almost Greek tragedy with which he left us.

[Getlo]

The same "friend" who fired them?


Good point.

Elvis is lying, plain and simple, when he tells Red in that phonecall (if indeed it's really is Elvis speaking, but that's another train of throught!) that he didn't know how the firings were going to go down.

He knew very well what was happening, and the ramifications that were likely to follow.

[cameron]

Thank you for RE-STATING my comment ;);)



I don't think the MM knew they were enablers! As stated the MM were NOT qualified to deal with Elvis' addictions, they were not psychologists! Some, if not all had their own demons to deal with.



I think we have all heard the stories of the intervention the MM, Girlfriends and Dr. Nick had tried.... placebo's, detox in the hospital and confrontations etc. if it were as easy as your comments make it sound Elvis would survived Aug 16th 1977. I have lost count of how many times it has come up in threads where people say "you weren't there, how can you know". You are guilty of making these same assumptions with your comments :hmm:



The fact that Red & Sonny were given the bullet after many years of loyal service disproves this theory, he would have found more enablers and carried on with the meds... as he did, addicts can always justify their actions :!:



A bit of a loaded question but the answer is 'Both'....... it was a mutual relationship we each benefiting from what the needed from each other.

What is your problem, JJ?? I pretty much agreed with all you said.
No one could have helped him , so long as there were others there to put up with it !!

[cameron]

The same "friend" who fired them?

Don't get me wrong here, Elvis had every right as an employer to hire and fire who he wanted, however Sonny and Red had been treated unfairly in the scheme of things and Elvis acknowledged that in the phone call to Red. It has always been said that Elvis would have hired these guys back at some point, when was that going to be? It had been quite some time and they hadn't heard from Elvis until the book EWH was in the pipeline.............

I love Elvis to bits but you have to be dispassionate when dealing with peoples lives, Elvis wasn't always the good guy. Despite our fierce loyalty for our guy, we have to admit he was no saint.

I think you need to re-think your position too. I answered a question .I wasn't responding to you .
IF they knew Elvis would have rehired them, why run so fast to tell THEIR story ,without considering HIS feelings ?

[Jumpsuit Junkie]

What is your problem, JJ?? I pretty much agreed with all you said.
No one could have helped him , so long as there were others there to put up with it !!

The problem is that you do not get the point I was making at all!!

Your comment above proves that! I don't think the MM "Put up with it!!" I think they tried to help Elvis, but (yet again) they were not qualified to deal with Elvis' addictions.

............Never mind, I'm going to look for that Elvis sideburns thread :P

[cameron]

Good point.

Elvis is lying, plain and simple, when he tells Red in that phonecall (if indeed it's really is Elvis speaking, but that's another train of throught!) that he didn't know how the firings were going to go down.

He knew very well what was happening, and the ramifications that were likely to follow.

:hmm:Now you're doubting the phone call ?? From a MM person??
Amazing !!

[Getlo]

............Never mind, I'm going to look for that Elvis sideburns thread :P


:lmfao::lmfao::lmfao:

I prefer the 1970 ones! :king:

[Getlo]

:hmm:Now you're doubting the phone call ?? From a MM person?? Amazing !!

Your childish and snide comments aside, madam, you have made the incorrect assumption that I automaticall believe everything the MM has to say (unlike you, who believes eveything they say is a lie).

I have listened to the phonecall three times now and, from the link I listened to at least (the one I posted in an earlier thread), I'm not sure it's actually Elvis. Perhaps it's the source I was listening to, but I do have my doubts.

Perhaps someone else here has a better-sounding link?

[cameron]

The problem is that you do not get the point I was making at all!!

Your comment above proves that! I don't think the MM "Put up with it!!" I think they tried to help Elvis, but (yet again) they were not qualified to deal with Elvis' addictions.

............Never mind, I'm going to look for that Elvis sideburns thread :P

Evidently, I don't get your point.
If it's plain too others, would it not be plain to them they were not qualified to help him?
They were NOT bound to stay with him .Any could have left at any time and IMO, should have. IMO, it just shows they needed as much help as Elvis.

[Getlo]

They were NOT bound to stay with him .Any could have left at any time and IMO, should have.

Aren't you one those people who thinks that friends stand by friends no matter what? By inference, you're saying there is a limit to friendship.

And, if the MM had left, with whom do you suggest Elvis would have replaced them? Which knights in shining armour would have come in and saved the King?

[cameron]

Your childish and snide comments aside, madam, you have made the incorrect assumption that I automaticall believe everything the MM has to say (unlike you, who believes eveything they say is a lie).

I have listened to the phonecall three times now and, from the link I listened to at least (the one I posted in an earlier thread), I'm not sure it's actually Elvis. Perhaps it's the source I was listening to, but I do have my doubts.

Perhaps someone else here has a better-sounding link?

MADAM !!
You only believe things that fit your percetion it seems.
But, once again you've all taken this thread OFF TOPIC!!

I would have let Elvis know I loved and supported him; but it would be entirely up to him if he chose to help himself .
I couldn't/wouldn't have stayed to watch . I've never been impressed nor intimidated by anyone.

[cameron]

Aren't you one those people who thinks that friends stand by friends no matter what? By inference, you're saying there is a limit to friendship.

And, if the MM had left, with whom do you suggest Elvis would have replaced them? Which knights in shining armour would have come in and saved the King?

I stand by my friends. That doesn't mean I'd hang around to watch them self distruct. I'd be there when he needed me. Period.

The King would soon discover he had to help himself, or stand alone .

[jak]

I just dont think it was so easy to just walk away from Elvis.Just walking away sounds real easy but it's not.You can say the same thing about a crappy job but how many people just walk away?People are forced to endure certain situations out of necessity.Unless you were in that lifestyle with Elvis I find it impopssible to know how anyone would react.Im sure being around him and having their experiences made it an addicting lifestyle.
Jak

[cameron]

I just dont think it was so easy to just walk away from Elvis.Just walking away sounds real easy but it's not.You can say the same thing about a crappy job but how many people just walk away?People are forced to endure certain situations out of necessity.Unless you were in that lifestyle with Elvis I find it impopssible to know how anyone would react.Im sure being around him and having their experiences made it an addicting lifestyle.
Jak
I'm quit a few good jobs . Just because I didn't agree with the patient care .
Was it tough? You bet . To me, my ethics and my clients were much more important than any job.

I think Elvis and I would have clashed a lot. ;)

[jak]

I'm quit a few good jobs . Just because I didn't agree with the patient care .
Was it tough? You bet . To me, my ethics and my clients were much more important than any job.

I think Elvis and I would have clashed a lot. ;)

I dont think youre jobs would be in the category as an Elvis entourage member.I think that situation is beyond or grasp unless you lived it.
Jak

[cameron]

I dont think youre jobs would be in the category as an Elvis entourage member.I think that situation is beyond or grasp unless you lived it.
Jak
You're right on this one at least.
I have no desire to be a flunky to anyone.

[MissyM]

I wonder how many people could actually walk away from Elvis and not go back if he called. He could be very hard to turn down. He had a way with words. And that personality, you know it was magnetic.
I've said I don't think I could stay so close to the situation, but I know it would have taken me a while to get up the strength to remove myself and still stay friends. If I heard his voice, listened to his words, I'd be weak and probably cave a few times myself.
Once when he fired Billy he called him up at Billy's moms (they assumed it was him because it was a pattern and the phone kept ringing for a couple of days. Well, Lorraine told Billy not to answer the phone. She said, Don't you dare even talk to him Billy, you know he will sweet talk you and you'll go back and just to get fired again eventually. I think this was when Billy went back to his regular job. Mind you, Lorraine loved Elvis with all her heart. This is a story my husband told me. I believe him 100 percent. But it just shows that Elvis had a lot of control over those guys. (emotionally too, not just monitarily)

[Jumpsuit Junkie]

Evidently, I don't get your point.
If it's plain too others, would it not be plain to them they were not qualified to help him?
They were NOT bound to stay with him .Any could have left at any time and IMO, should have. IMO, it just shows they needed as much help as Elvis.

Just because you are not qualified to help does not mean that you do not care, not everyone has the cold approach of just leaving someone who is in need of support.

At what point would all of the MM left Elvis? 1950's, 1960's or 1970's because he had been taking drugs throughout this whole period, at what point did he deserve to be abandoned?

Nobody is disputing the fact that the MM probably needed help to get them on the straight and narrow, however the majority of them are still alive and have dealt with their addictions.

[cameron]

Just because you are not qualified to help does not mean that you do not care, not everyone has the cold approach of just leaving someone who is in need of support.

At what point would all of the MM left Elvis? 1950's, 1960's or 1970's because he had been taking drugs throughout this whole period, at what point did he deserve to be abandoned?

Nobody is disputing the fact that the MM probably needed help to get them on the straight and narrow, however the majority of them are still alive and have dealt with their addictions.

Just what would you have done, JJ?? Since that question is the topic of this thread; not putting down others for their opinions ?

[jak]

You're right on this one at least.
I have no desire to be a flunky to anyone.

Easy to say when you never had the chance to be one to Elvis.

[cameron]

Easy to say when you never had the chance to be one to Elvis.

OFF TOPIC !!

[Getlo]

Easy to say when you never had the chance to be one to Elvis.


OFF TOPIC !!

How on earth this is off topic when the thread is "What would you have done" is beyond me. ;)

And you're avoiding jak's statement ...

[cameron]

How on earth this is off topic when the thread is "What would you have done" is beyond me. ;)

And you're avoiding jak's statement ...

What would you have done? Implies I have an opinion on what I would have done to help Elvis.

OFF TOPIC
Answering that question just says I've never been a flunky to EP.
Answered that in many ways. I wouldn't do it.:)

[Getlo]

What would you have done? Implies I have an opinion on what I would have done to help Elvis.


So, if you don't, then stop posting on this thread ... ;):'(:blink:

[cameron]

So, if you don't, then stop posting on this thread ... ;):'(:blink:


I've already given my opinion on what I could/would do to try and help.
What was yours again?

[Getlo]

What was yours again?

I haven't given my opinion yet, old girl, nor have I pretended otherwise.

[Sonny]

Can't you all discuss things in a friendly manner?

Sonny

[kellyelvis]

it depends on how these friends of his approached elvis if they were preaching to him or saying u gotta do this that and the other of course he wouldnt listen. Elvis was the kind of man thatd dint like being told what to do especially by people whom he knew were only there cos they were in Elvis' pocket. Elvis just wanted someone that loved and cared for him because they really genuinly care. He wanted to be accepted as he was or not at all. It was all something to hide behind. The real Elvis was kept hidden cos he never trusted anyone enough to show it. Elvis Would never like to admit that he really needed someone people would think he was weak. He had been dependant on other people since birth. He never knew what it was like to fend for yourself not really. His mum was really close to him, walked him to school everyday. I'm not saying Gladys was wrong i'm just saying elvis got dependant on other people to do things for him. So when she died he didnt know what to do. He was thrown in the deep end. He just wanted to be cared for is that so wrong. He turned to the pills cos he felt they and food were the only things he had control over. Everything else was done for him The Colonel had him sown up so tight. I wish i knew what the colonel had on elvis that made him not stand up to him. He knew something about elvis that probably would have ruined him. so elvis was stuck. He wanted out.

I am tired and i need thy strenghed and thy power, to guide me over my darkest hour.....Lead me oh lord wont you lead me

[Getlo]

I wish i knew what the colonel had on elvis that made him not stand up to him. He knew something about elvis that probably would have ruined him.

That is total fantasy.

The Colonel had nothing "on" Elvis. Nor Vernon either: some have suggested Vernon's jailing is what the Colonel "had", but that is also far-fetched.

[Jumpsuit Junkie]

Just what would you have done, JJ??



So, what could I have done that his Father, several Doctors and the MM hadn't already tried?

I'm afraid Elvis' life was a 'fête accompli' and I wouldn't be so arrogant to say that I could have made that difference as much as I would want too.

I have already made that comment?

[cameron]

If you're gonna post some post it all.And all the others where you kept questioning me .

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jumpsuit Junkie
Just because you are not qualified to help does not mean that you do not care, not everyone has the cold approach of just leaving someone who is in need of support.

At what point would all of the MM left Elvis? 1950's, 1960's or 1970's because he had been taking drugs throughout this whole period, at what point did he deserve to be abandoned?

Nobody is disputing the fact that the MM probably needed help to get them on the straight and narrow, however the majority of them are still alive and have dealt with their addictions.

Just what would you have done, JJ?? Since that question is the topic of this thread; not putting down others for their opinions ?
__________________

[Jumpsuit Junkie]

If you're gonna post some post it all.And all the others where you kept questioning me .

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jumpsuit Junkie
Just because you are not qualified to help does not mean that you do not care, not everyone has the cold approach of just leaving someone who is in need of support.

At what point would all of the MM left Elvis? 1950's, 1960's or 1970's because he had been taking drugs throughout this whole period, at what point did he deserve to be abandoned?

Nobody is disputing the fact that the MM probably needed help to get them on the straight and narrow, however the majority of them are still alive and have dealt with their addictions.

Just what would you have done, JJ?? Since that question is the topic of this thread; not putting down others for their opinions ?
__________________

I suggest that you need to look elsewhere for your fun, I have answered your question(s) and the quote you have given of mine is not off topic it relates to the help offered via the MM and their ability

[cameron]

If you think I like having to fight some just because I say something; you're far from the truth. Things are peaceful until certain ones that think this is a game starts in on others .

[Merry]

As I've said before, Cameron is not AJ, I'm acquaintances with AJ.

Please stop accusing someone of something, you don't know for sure, and presuming.

This ganging up on someone, is very sad, and very unfair.

We are all Elvis' fans.

I do wish people would realise, that everyone has feelings, and to gang up on someone like this, is just plain low, in my opinion.

Sorry, Cameron, for butting in, I know you don't need me to do this, please forgive the intrusion, but I think you are a lovely man, and I couldn't even read all of it, it made me so upset, reading someone being ganged up on.


:hug:
Kim

[cameron]

Thanks, Jess.
Just don't get yourself in any trouble.
It's just not worth it.
Appreciate you though .(y)

[KPM]

I would like to think I'd want to do an intervention.
We did that to my mother in law 12 years ago(before they called it an intervention) she was getting pain medicines and anti-depressants from 4 doctors without any of them knowing it. We later found out she had been doing it for 5 years. At that time her health problemswere mainly in her
head.
Her main doctor suspected something after he ran a series of blood tests and medicines he was not prescribing showed up in them. He called my wife and asked her to "snoop around" the next time she visited her mom. Thats how we found out.
9 of us including all her kids, and her pastor confronted her. We told her she could go on her own to get help or her kids would sign papers and get it
for her. She went nuts, got mad, tried to throw us out threatened to call
the police if we did not leave. It was horrible.
My wife got all the medicines from her cabinet and took them to show her doctor-he contacted the other doctors and she went into a hospital for about a month. For a while after she got back home she was mad at us all.
But it only lasted 6 months or so. It was not easy to do.
But its easy with hindsight to say now what we might have done for Elvis-it would have been very different in the "midst of the storm" so to speak.

[Jumpsuit Junkie]

As I've said before, Cameron is not AJ, I'm acquaintances with AJ.

Please stop accusing someone of something, you don't know for sure, and presuming.

This ganging up on someone, is very sad, and very unfair.

We are all Elvis' fans.

I do wish people would realise, that everyone has feelings, and to gang up on someone like this, is just plain low, in my opinion.

Sorry, Cameron, for butting in, I know you don't need me to do this, please forgive the intrusion, but I think you are a lovely man, and I couldn't even read all of it, it made me so upset, reading someone being ganged up on.


:hug:
Kim

I have commented On the subject Not the person, I don't care if cameron is ajr or not, I knew it would only be a matter of time before you started on me again, the same thing happens every time. One day you might stand up for me although I seriously doubt it.

It seems to me that because I am a moderator I am singled out for attention when I make comments or quote others. Yes I have commented on Cameron's posts, but I am not the one who is carrying this too far. As for your comment " I couldn't even read all of it" sums it up for me, it seems you haven't had the decency to read all the threads and have come to a conclusion. I am disappointed (n)

Please read my posts without bias.

[Merry]

I have commented On the subject Not the person, I don't care if cameron is ajr or not, I knew it would only be a matter of time before you started on me again, the same thing happens every time. One day you might stand up for me although I seriously doubt it.

It seems to me that because I am a moderator I am singled out for attention when I make comments or quote others. Yes I have commented on Cameron's posts, but I am not the one who is carrying this too far. As for your comment " I couldn't even read all of it" sums it up for me, it seems you haven't had the decency to read all the threads and have come to a conclusion. I am disappointed (n)

Please read my posts without bias.


No Matt,

I was talking to GETLO, mainly. (As he keeps going on and on "madam"). I should be more direct, I just don't want to start things up.

Matt, if people were ganging up on you, and being nasty, I would stand up for you.

You and I have always come to an understanding, taken things privately, when we have been mad, I think differently to you, completely opposite, to be frank, but you haven't ever, been rude to me. Thank you. I have given you the impression I have (you feeling I've been rude, which is in this case), and I've clarified myself, and apologised, which I do now. I didn't single you out.

However, my views, as you as a mod, yes, I agree with you, you should be neutral.

Watching Getlo (who doesn't stop with anyone), then Jak joining in (we also take it privately, to sort it out......hi Jak {waving, lol}, then you, oh Matt..... I skimmed them, no-one wants to feel bad, sad. :'(

Thank you for expressing youself to me, Matt, I appreciate it. I also appreciate having the opportunity, to reply, clarifying.

I'm going for a walk now, it is beautiful here, this morning. The birds are singing, the weather is peeeeeerfect!

Take care,
Kim

[Suzan]

Good point.

Elvis is lying, plain and simple, when he tells Red in that phonecall (if indeed it's really is Elvis speaking, but that's another train of throught!) that he didn't know how the firings were going to go down.

He knew very well what was happening, and the ramifications that were likely to follow.

I agree and disagree. LOL :hug:

I don't think Elvis did know, I think he gave a set of instructions to his dad Vernon, expected those instructions to be carried out and they weren't, for whatever reason, Vernon is neither here to tell his side nor disprove it, he chose a different path. Like I've said b4 in another thread, should Elvis have check to make sure? Absolutely...but he didn't, again for reason's we'll never know, whether his trust in his daddy was that great or he was used to things being done how he said, or for an entirely different reason, we don't know, we'll never know, but he didn't....the rest as they say is history.

[Jumpsuit Junkie]

No Matt,

I was talking to GETLO, mainly. (As he keeps going on and on "madam"). I should be more direct, I just don't want to start things up.

Matt, if people were ganging up on you, and being nasty, I would stand up for you.

You and I have always come to an understanding, taken things privately, when we have been mad, I think differently to you, completely opposite, to be frank, but you haven't ever, been rude to me. Thank you. I have given you the impression I have (you feeling I've been rude, which is in this case), and I've clarified myself, and apologised, which I do now. I didn't single you out.

However, my views, as you as a mod, yes, I agree with you, you should be neutral.

Watching Getlo (who doesn't stop with anyone), then Jak joining in (we also take it privately, to sort it out......hi Jak {waving, lol}, then you, oh Matt..... I skimmed them, no-one wants to feel bad, sad. :'(

Thank you for expressing youself to me, Matt, I appreciate it. I also appreciate having the opportunity, to reply, clarifying.

I'm going for a walk now, it is beautiful here, this morning. The birds are singing, the weather is peeeeeerfect!

Take care,
Kim

Thank you for responding Jess, I had a rush of blood to the head. I guess both of us have had time to cool off :doh:

[Lion]

Mmm, I think Elvis like his mother suffered from a mild depression which was made worse by the meds he took. I also think he was over worked at times. I also think he wasn't challenged musically for a long time so a sense of boredom affected him.

So lets see what would i have done.

from all i've read about Elvis he didn't take to kindly to advice or help. So for starters it would be hard

So i guess I would tried to get him away from the Col that would have lead to hopefully him being more challenged with his career. this would hopefully lift his boredom and depression.

try to get him off the pills. Get him talking to someone about his feelings. get him touring in other countries and also just seeing other countries, play tourist.

Encourage him to write his own stuff be it movies, music whatever.

Keep his mind active Elvis was an intelligent man so maybe even encourage him to study.

I don't know that's a hard question isn't.

i know i'd be honest with him.

Could have been my words really...

[Getlo]

I don't care if cameron is ajr or not.

JJ, with respect: should you not care about this if you're a mod?


No Matt,

I was talking to GETLO, mainly. (As he keeps going on and on "madam").

Yep. I'm sure cameron is smart enough to figure out what I suspect about her. I've been accused of the same, and much worse.

And thank you for taking the time to publicly single me out! ;)

[Merry]

JJ, with respect: should you not care about this if you're a mod?



Yep. I'm sure cameron is smart enough to figure out what I suspect about her. I've been accused of the same, and much worse.

And thank you for taking the time to publicly single me out! ;)




You know, you attack people, then act the victim.

:hmm:

[Merry]

Thank you for responding Jess, I had a rush of blood to the head. I guess both of us have had time to cool off :doh:



(y) Thank you.

[cameron]

Unfortunately, I could have done nothing to help Elvis ,if everyone else continued to support him in everything he did.
To be afraid of losing your job is not a good excuse, IMO.
People were only thinking of themselves, not what was best for Elvis.

[jak]

Unfortunately, I could have done nothing to help Elvis ,if everyone else continued to support him in everything he did.
To be afraid of losing your job is not a good excuse, IMO.
People were only thinking of themselves, not what was best for Elvis.

None of us can say that's the way it was.We do know that attempts were made to help Elvis.He just wasnt having it.Elvis is always made out to be a victim which is just shifting the blame away from him.It's time to just accept he had a fatal flaw and weakness he couldnt control.He was a grown man and bore the responsibility for his actions.None of us were in the situation with him so it's quite unfair to point fingers at those that were.Shouldnt the "walk a mile in my shoes" logic apply to everyone?Once again I say Elvis was the supreme leader of his self constructed world and nobody was going to change his ways if he didnt want them to.
Jak

[Getlo]

Shouldnt the "walk a mile in my shows" logic apply to everyone?

We know very well it doesn't seem to, jak.

There are those who extend Elvis a lot of slack (too much in some cases) but won't even attempt to see things from the MM's or others' points of view.

[jak]

We know very well it doesn't seem to, jak.

There are those who extend Elvis a lot of slack (too much in some cases) but won't even attempt to see things from the MM's or others' points of view.

It's a never ending search for a scapegoat.

[cameron]

None of us can say that's the way it was.We do know that attempts were made to help Elvis.He just wasnt having it.Elvis is always made out to be a victim which is just shifting the blame away from him.It's time to just accept he had a fatal flaw and weakness he couldnt control.He was a grown man and bore the responsibility for his actions.None of us were in the situation with him so it's quite unfair to point fingers at those that were.Shouldnt the "walk a mile in my shoes" logic apply to everyone?Once again I say Elvis was the supreme leader of his self constructed world and nobody was going to change his ways if he didnt want them to.
Jak

When we all accept that we ,as humans ,have our own flaws. Then too, I accept everyone elses.
I do not blame anyone ;except when they make excuses for themselves by blaming others by forgetting their own weaknesses.

[Getlo]

I do not blame anyone ;except when they make excuses for themselves by blaming others by forgetting their own weaknesses.

And where exactly do Sonny and Red forget their own weaknesses? They are the first to admit they had problems with drugs and other issues, and blame no one but themselves for their own choices.

[jak]

When we all accept that we ,as humans ,have our own flaws. Then too, I accept everyone elses.
I do not blame anyone ;except when they make excuses for themselves by blaming others by forgetting their own weaknesses.

I dont think those guys have made excuses.They may lay the blame on Elvis' shoulders which is entirely correct.The have admitted they all had drug problems back then.They were just strong enough or lucky enough to overcome the situation.For whatever reasons that's something Elvis couldnt do.They had to get their own lives to worry about.Was it their job to hold Elvis' hand like a small child 24/7 if he didnt want them to?Dealing with Elvis was probably like punching youreself in the face over and over.Sooner or later youve had enough.
Jak

[cameron]

And where exactly do Sonny and Red forget their own weaknesses? They are the first to admit they had problems with drugs and other issues, and blame no one but themselves for their own choices.

OFF TOPIC !!
Unless and until you stick to the topic of this and other threads .
I'm not answering .

[MissyM]

I wasn't even going to reply again because it seems everything has been said. What I see is a group of men, each with their own weaknesses, all from a background of not having much. I think they fed off of each other, Elvis included. It's like that in a family. (and I truely think they had to be like one) One was weak in one area, one strong in another. Each one struggled to be strong, and yet carried demons around. And I think most were insecure. That's why each wanted to be most important to Elvis. I think he tried to be all things to them and they tried to in turn meet his needs. Elvis was a leader and a nuturing person like his mom. But he was one man and could only give so much. He was not equipped to do it and neither were any of them fully equipped to meet all his needs. We are forever children I feel, doing what we need to survive, grow, and be nurtured. It doesn't stop in adulthood. And depending on what your childhood was, your needs are greater. And I think in a childlike way they were all competing for Elvis's love and attention. Right or wrong that is the way it was. It was a classic co-dependancy, both emotionally and financially. Things can get pretty hairy under those circumstances. Decisions are made based on that stuff. Therefore they will not be mature decisions at times. And You know what, I still think that even with Elvis is gone, it still is in play. (at least to a certain degree)
Oh and I think Pricilla is in the mix also.

[cameron]

I wasn't even going to reply again because it seems everything has been said. What I see is a group of men, each with their own weaknesses, all from a background of not having much. I think they fed off of each other, Elvis included. It's like that in a family. (and I truely think they had to be like one) One was weak in one area, one strong in another. Each one struggled to be strong, and yet carried demons around. And I think most were insecure. That's why each wanted to be most important to Elvis. I think he tried to be all things to them and they tried to in turn meet his needs. Elvis was a leader and a nuturing person like his mom. But he was one man and could only give so much. He was not equipped to do it and neither were any of them fully equipped to meet all his needs. We are forever children I feel, doing what we need to survive, grow, and be nurtured. It doesn't stop in adulthood. And depending on what your childhood was, your needs are greater. And I think in a childlike way they were all competing for Elvis's love and attention. Right or wrong that is the way it was. It was a classic co-dependancy, both emotionally and financially. Things can get pretty hairy under those circumstances. Decisions are made based on that stuff. Therefore they will not be mature decisions at times. And You know what, I still think that even with Elvis is gone, it still is in play. (at least to a certain degree)
Oh and I think Pricilla is in the mix also.

I agree with you, Missy. Very co-dependent and jealous of each other .
Not a good situation for any of them.
That being said; no one could help any of them.

[Getlo]

OFF TOPIC !!
Unless and until you stick to the topic of this and other threads .
I'm not answering .

I was responding to your own post, madam ...


When we all accept that we ,as humans ,have our own flaws. Then too, I accept everyone elses.
I do not blame anyone ;except when they make excuses for themselves by blaming others by forgetting their own weaknesses.

[MissyM]

Well, someone once told me that you can't rely on someone else to make you happy and emotionally healthy. I found that to be soo true. I'm still working on it and I'm 55.

[Getlo]

Well, someone once told me that you can't rely on someone else to make you happy and emotionally healthy.

Absolutely.

You're born alone, and you die alone.

And the only person in life you can trust 100% is yourself, no one else.

[KPM]

Absolutely.

You're born alone, and you die alone.

And the only person in life you can trust 100% is yourself, no one else.

Don't agree-I trust my wife, my grown kids, and my two brothers 100%. I would put my life in their hands any day of the week. And they can expect the same from me. I may have been born alone-but I'll die with them by my side.
Also I've said this before-No man is an island. And even an island is changed and effected by the tides that smash the shore.

[Diane]

I agree, I have a couple of friends beside my family that I would trust with my life. I am part of them, they are part of me.

Diane

[jak]

Absolutely.

You're born alone, and you die alone.

And the only person in life you can trust 100% is yourself, no one else.

Hey Getlo
I may have to jump ship on that statement.That may even be to bleak for me.Hopefully we all have a few people in our lives we can count on.I know where youre coming from but sometimes we must think happy thoughts;)
Jak

[KPM]

Well Jak I don't know if its happy thoughts;)-but I do know for me its the truth. Some people may not be as fortunate to have people they can count on but I am lucky in that respect. It takes a strong love/bond to say you trust someone 100%. Trouble is sometimes of our own making, and sometimes it just happens-no matter I know I can count fully on those I listed to do whatevers right. Its a great feeling to know that.

[MissyM]

Absolutely.

You're born alone, and you die alone.

And the only person in life you can trust 100% is yourself, no one else.
__________________
I get that, I know one thing, I will never be dependant on anyone else to make me happy. It isn't about trust to me. There are some ppl I trust, but they are "icing on the cake". First, my life depends on me. Part of life is loss, one way or the other so it's not good to be so dependant. I think that is why there was alot of trouble in Elvis's situation, the whole group of people got to dependant on each other, and drugs. When one left, the whole group suffered. When Elvis left, life with out him and the others was so foreign.

[jak]

Well Jak I don't know if its happy thoughts;)-but I do know for me its the truth. Some people may not be as fortunate to have people they can count on but I am lucky in that respect. It takes a strong love/bond to say you trust someone 100%. Trouble is sometimes of our own making, and sometimes it just happens-no matter I know I can count fully on those I listed to do whatevers right. Its a great feeling to know that.

You are fortunate and I do believe I am also.I would hate to think otherwise.We all need support from others at different times in our lives.I know my family would do anything for me.My wife may be a bit "iffy" though.Just kidding!

[presley31]

I agree, I have a couple of friends beside my family that I would trust with my life. I am part of them, they are part of me.

Diane

yep me to diane

[Jumpsuit Junkie]

JJ, with respect: should you not care about this if you're a mod?

There has to be proof that cameron is ajr and this is not conclusive! It would not matter if cameron is ajr in the sense that the coments made by one or the other would still be the same. I address the comments not the person.



Absolutely.

You're born alone, and you die alone.

And the only person in life you can trust 100% is yourself, no one else.

Even then Elvis couldn't trust himself :hmm:

[KPM]

Absolutely.

You're born alone, and you die alone.

And the only person in life you can trust 100% is yourself, no one else.
__________________
I get that, I know one thing, I will never be dependant on anyone else to make me happy. It isn't about trust to me. There are some ppl I trust, but they are "icing on the cake". First, my life depends on me. Part of life is loss, one way or the other so it's not good to be so dependant. I think that is why there was alot of trouble in Elvis's situation, the whole group of people got to dependant on each other, and drugs. When one left, the whole group suffered. When Elvis left, life with out him and the others was so foreign.
You can be the most independant person in the world and still end up needing help somewhere along the way. I think I am a pretty independant person-but in 52 years I have needed help a time or two and luckily have ended up getting it. By the same token I have offered my hand out to help others when a problem arises where they seem to need it.
Sometimes I didn't know "I needed help" and it took some convincing to make me get it. But we're all different.;)

[cameron]

It is quite different to depend on someone to make your life work.
One should have their own ideal/beliefs independent of anyone.

It's something else to have people that love you ,who you can trust and know they'll be there through the bad times as well as the good.

If there's no love or trust; what a lonely life it can be , IMO.
I think that was missing for Elvis after he lost his mother.

[Jumpsuit Junkie]

I don't think Elvis did really have anyone that could relate to him on the same level, how could they? Here was a guy who had the world at his feet and even he couldn't understand why he was chosen?

I'm sure Elvis tested everyone around him and he probably found they would do just about anything he wanted! That has to in some way undermine everyone around him including his father, so in effect Elvis had no equal in his group and that must have eventually made him feel lonely.

Given the above scenario it would be difficult for any of Elvis' subordinates to offer any advice worth taking :hmm:

[cameron]

I don't think Elvis did really have anyone that could relate to him on the same level, how could they? Here was a guy who had the world at his feet and even he couldn't understand why he was chosen?

I'm sure Elvis tested everyone around him and he probably found they would do just about anything he wanted! That has to in some way undermine everyone around him including his father, so in effect Elvis had no equal in his group and that must have eventually made him feel lonely.

Given the above scenario it would be difficult for any of Elvis' subordinates to offer any advice worth taking :hmm:

I can agree with this.
Perhaps that's why he looked to a higher source for answers.
Someone or something that could provide him with the answers he was seeking.
In that case; he found what he was looking for, IMO.

[Diane]

I agree with you Matt. I think Elvis was one of the loneliest people ever was among so many around him. No one had gone through what he did in his climb to fame and no one could understand how he felt. I bet there was a sense of panic at times when he wondered where is this taking me and a lot of other questions as well.

I wish he had had more support and someone besides Larry to talk to about his search through his books. No one else seemed to be the least bit interested in discussing these things that mattered so much to him.

Diane

[KPM]

I don't think Elvis did really have anyone that could relate to him on the same level, how could they? Here was a guy who had the world at his feet and even he couldn't understand why he was chosen?

I'm sure Elvis tested everyone around him and he probably found they would do just about anything he wanted! That has to in some way undermine everyone around him including his father, so in effect Elvis had no equal in his group and that must have eventually made him feel lonely.

Given the above scenario it would be difficult for any of Elvis' subordinates to offer any advice worth taking :hmm:
Did you ever notice the people who Elvis seemed to listen to closest- with some respect- were people who talked straight to him with no punches pulled-Steve Bender and Marty Pasetta, come to mind. I think so many people did whatever he said that it may have been hard for him to respect them. IMO

[cameron]

I don't guess you'd care to expand on your post., Shazam?
It's very interesting. I might know to what you refer .
If you feel so inclined, I'd appreciate knowing your meaning.
Thanks/Cam

[presley31]

yes cameron l was wondering the same thing??

[Diane]

I'm totally lost about the #155 post. Who is Fritz anyway and what does it have to do with this thread? :blink:

Diane

[Getlo]

people who talked straight to him with no punches pulled-Steve Bender and Marty Pasetta, come to mind.

Don't forget Chips Moman as well! Yeah, the music-type people spoke straight to Elvis, but the personal friends ... less so.


Fitz, what you did, as I've said before, was what you had to do, and I respect you. ... I love you, please don't go, from me.

What on earth is this post on about??? ;):blink:

[utmom2008]

Fitz, what you did, as I've said before, was what you had to do, and I respect you.

What they talk about, is a hobby to them, analysing, arguing, obviously doing so, as they want to; sometimes, also, with like minded people. I feel that then there are the other people, who perhaps don't feel, that their world revolves around them, only. They are the ones who keep silent, or don't say much, or try to help, all different shades. They care for others, not just how everything may affect their personal insular world, and ego, but other people, too.

Fame is just an illusion, since you put it that way, honey, and as I read it, yes, I can see your point. However, there are real people in this world, and I hope I'm one of them, to you. You know how I feel about you. I know the situation, which is obviously not a "normal" situation, how it probably has to be: email buddies, or just how it has been, in the last year, which you feel comfortable with. I care so much about you, I'll take anything. I think you would know how it makes me feel, to read, that you say you are going. As I said a long time ago to you, through care and love for you, I feel that it's obviously not healthy to read the negativity. In saying that about others, I've only ever, come from a place of caring. Yes, you know, it depressed me, reading it too, and with my history, as you know, (now going through property settlement), and worry for others, I've come out of depression. I don't know the answer with you staying, you can only do what is in your heart, and is best for you, but I don't want you to go from me. I pray that we can have contact, somewhere, perhaps here, I don't know. I'm not happy here, either, to say the least, because of the reasons you mentioned, just before. When I'm upset, I loose my words, and what I'm saying here is important, so all I can do, is talk from my heart. I love you, please don't go, from me.
Shazam......have you been into some of Elvis's mind-altering drugs?? :lol: :lol:

[Broussey]

I would have just loved him ..

[TLC67]

Shazam......have you been into some of Elvis's mind-altering drugs?? :lol: :lol:

I was kinda wondering the same thing, :lmfao:!